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Tire Issues

22K views 53 replies 23 participants last post by  Sean Nelson 
#1 ·
Has any one had a flat tire from puncture in the tread area not in the sidewalls? I was wondering how well the self sealing tires were working, I may want to get them on one of my Volts when the time comes. My main issue is that they are not calling them self sealing on the Michelin website yet.
 
#2 ·
I ran over a nail first day I had the car, I know terrible. However I just pulled it out that day and haven't had any issues since then. It was almost dead center of the tread and went straight in. So I have the experience that at least in that condition the tire seems to seal itself just fine. It also wasn't a huge nail, just a roofing nail.
 
#3 ·
Thanks for your response. Doesn't it seem odd Michelin is not even showing tires for the Bolt EV when searching by vehicle not to mention not even coming up in a site search?
 
#4 · (Edited)
I would just carry a tire plug kit and a 12 volt tire pump. I keep one in all my vehicles and on my motorcycles. It's easy to use and the tire can be used until it's worn out.
The tire rope plug kit has never let me down and it's cheap and easy :nerd: Tires are way too much
for this simple issue and I will not replace mine with the pre-sealing goop. No need for it and tire plugs won't cause TPMS sensor failures like Tire Slime will.
 
#6 ·
I think the tires on our Bolts are made specifically for GM with the self sealing in them. I think the only place you can buy them at this time is at the dealership. I'm pretty sure the ones for sale on sites like Tire Rack are the same, but without the self seal coating.

There was another member here who posted that they got a screw and the self seal didn't fully seal and the tire slowly lost air. He had it plugged at a tire shop. Because of this report, I bought a 12v tire inflator just in case. A slow leak you can pump up and drive on to get to a tire shop.
 
#7 ·
#8 ·
^ I had sent an email to Tire Rack tech support regarding the first tire in the list above.. they replied that the "Bolt Tire" listed above was not the Self Sealing variety.

IIRC.. at this time you can only get the Bolt Self Sealing tire from a GM dealer.
 
#9 ·
^ I had sent an email to Tire Rack tech support regarding the first tire in the list above.. they replied that the "Bolt Tire" listed above was not the Self Sealing variety.

IIRC.. at this time you can only get the Bolt Self Sealing tire from a GM dealer.

If it has the DT emblem on the tire like the stock OEM that came with the Bolt EV it is the same self sealing tire.
 
#10 ·
^ Well, that's the $132 (including shipping) question then- no one here has ordered one yet and tech support stated in writing it's not Self Sealing.
 
#12 ·
^ saw that.... but that's no guarantee it's the self sealing tire just "Different Tread" whatever that means.

I'm trying to "chat" live w/Tire Rack now... but the connection is unavailable.
 
#13 ·
If Michelin is not advertising them as such on their website Tire Rack office people can't confirm if they are self sealing or not. Where is Ladagoboy when you need him?
 
#14 ·
It's my turn. Found a screw (1/8" or smaller in diameter) well embedded in the tread and removed it. The instrument panel reports that this tire is 1lb less pressure so I'll be keeping my eye on it. My question is whether the self sealing solution is to be considered a permanent solution, or is it designed to last for a limited amount of time? My guess is that the tire dropped the 1lb of pressure in filling the leak. I'll follow the manual and bring that tire up to it's recommended pressure (35) and then follow it from there.
thanks
 
#15 ·
I was told by Pam Fletcher @ the 2016 DC auto show unveiling in a meet and greet Q & A that they are permanent not like a run flat.
 
#16 ·
After driving around for several hours, the self sealing tires appear to have worked. The tire pressure evened out to 35. I did go and get a $20 tire inflator that plugs into the 12v outlet. Not sure I'll ever need it, but it gives a bit of added security. In the photos below, the screw is shown sitting in where the hole is, but these were taken after I pulled the screw out. Originally, it was flush with the tread.
 

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#18 ·
I still haven't figured out how the sealant actually works. I've seen lots of fascinating youtube videos from bicycles all the way up to construction vehicles with tires as tall as me (6') and the sealants seem to work great. Based on a bit of investigation on my part, the ingredients seem to be alcohol, rubber bits and cellulose fibers. http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/pdfImages/fa/faab0f2f-ad21-45ce-977e-34b764758d8a.pdf

I'll assume that it's a permanent fix, but according to some websites such as: https://www.carsdirect.com/car-repair/tire-puncture-sealant-pros--cons
they say it's not a permanent fix. I'll monitor the situation as time goes on.
 
#19 ·
I wouldn't be to concerned with it, long as the puncture isn't an irregular shape. I have ridden mountain bikes for years and have been running tubeless with sealant for several years now. When I do get a puncture on those the sealant seals it fine in almost all cases and I very rarely touch it after. This is on a thin bike tire and is constantly going over uneven terrain.

Now take that and think about how these self sealing tires are constructed. They have to layers of tire with the sealant between those two layers. This allows the sealant to seal the hole, forming the plug. This plug of sealant now has pressure holding it in place from multiple directions and of course more sealant around it if the plug it formed ever does move. Add on to this that cars for the most part are driving mostly even surfaces so the impact the plug area takes is normally quite distributed across a large area of the tire.

What could cause seal like this trouble are large direct impacts to them, like hitting a big enough rock on the plug location directly. Something like that could dislocate that plug. But since the inside of the tire has more sealant left in there it should just reseal quite quickly. This is what happens on my mountain bike tires when I hit an old puncture sometimes, I will hear a little air escape some sealant come out and then it is sealed again.

So that was a long winded way of saying long as the hole isn't too large or irregularly shaped the sealant in the tire should be more than sufficient.
 
#20 ·
I forgot to mention how the sealants work. So no matter the formulation, rubber based, latex based or fiber based they all work under the same principles. Under normal conditions they are liquids of course. If you expose any of those compounds to the combination of air and high pressure and they become solids. Their behavior is like that of a non-newtonian fluid. So under normal circumstances they are liquids but under stress, high pressure, impacts, quick change in pressure, they become solids. The major difference between the tire sealants and a true non-newtonian fluid is that the sealants don't revert back to liquids once the pressure is gone. Tire sealants actually permanently solidify once they are exposed to the high pressure from a air escaping from a hole and the pressure of being pushed into it. Michelin uses a sealant compound that is rubber based so it forms a permanent rubber plug in the hole from the puncture. Like I mentioned above the plug could be knocked out, like any other plug you would put into a tire. It just isn't very likely due to the impact required to do so. Even if it did happen more sealant would form another plug.
 
#21 · (Edited)
The sealant is exposed to high pressure and air while it is inside the tire.

It isn't "exposed to high pressure from air escaping from a hole" and it isn't exposed to any additional pressure when "pushed into" a hole.

Perhaps you are referring to a leak causing a pressure differential between the inside of the tire and exterior of the tire?

I don't know for certain what Michelin has done but it appears to use an inner liner that isn't punctured when the nail/screw punctures the outer tire and isn't some sort of special non-newtonian fluid. But if you have some links that better describe their technology I'm certainly interested in reading it. Or perhaps their inner liner does have properties of a non-newtonian fluid. Educate me.

The best reference I could find specifically about Michelin's self sealing tech is:
https://www.jaxtyres.com.au/blog/2011/05/michelins-self-seal-technology-to-become-standard/

This patent is also good reference material:
https://www.google.com/patents/US20140174639
 
#24 ·
Thanks for the discussion on how sealants work. I was curious to better understand the principles behind the sealant from a practical matter of determining whether it's ability to plug a hole was permanent or not. And, then under what conditions it might fail. I understand the above discussion is one of the 'principles of how a sealant generally works', but its far better than anything I could find on my own. And, as they say 'your mileage may vary' both literally and figuratively.
 
#25 ·
I have a buddy who owns a tire shop. He explained how these things work. There is a layer of soft, schmutzy stuff on the inside of the tire that seals around the nail or oozes into the hole. The reason it only works on the tread area is that centrifugal force and tire flex would eventually pull it towards the tread or separate it from the carcass if it were placed on the inside of the sidewalls. No non-newtonian fluids, no tractor beams, no leprechaun with a patch kit hiding inside.
Here's a snip from Continental's website (same technology)
"ContiSeal™ is a sticky, gum-like sealant layer that is inside the tyre in the tread area. The technology seals 80 per cent of all punctures and therefore reduces the risk of flat tyres. ContiSeal™ tyres are marked clearly with a symbol on the sidewall and are compatible with all commonly available wheel rims."
https://youtu.be/QJhF8hhxPfo
 
#26 ·
I didn't say it was a non-newtonian fluid, I was just using it an behavioral comparison. ;)

While the Contiseal stuff is similar to the Michelin technology, it is not the same. The Continental tech is under its own patent https://www.google.com/patents/US20150174970

The Michelin tech is under it's own patent https://www.google.com/patents/US20140174639

The Contiseal stuff is just their sealant tack layer tech, no change in the construction of the tire. The Michelin tires actually have a difference in construction.

Having said that, while the technology is not exactly the same, the premise of tire sealant itself still is generally the same. Tire gets hole, sealant fills hole and stops the air from escaping.
 
#28 ·
That generalized statement in that article doesn't make the technology the same. Read the patents yourself and you will see how they are different.

Like I already said though, all the tire sealants I know of work under the same basic principles. I've been using them in my MTB tires for almost a decade, worked the same then as it does now. So from that basic level, yes they are the same, implementation and construction though, they are not the same.
 
#32 ·
I would try one of the wick style plugs from the outside and maybe move it to the rear if it's a front tire.

On a conventional tire a tire shop would patch it from the inside for a permanent, professional fix, but with the self sealing goo in the Bolt tires I doubt any tire shop would do that.
 
#33 · (Edited)
Forgive the long post, but I wanted to share my experience with my first flat tire in the 2017 Chevy Bolt EV. I came out of work to the parking garage to find my information screen telling me that I had a left rear tire with a pressure of 6 psi. I looked and sure enough it appeared nearly flat. I felt around carefully for a nail or screw but did not feel any. I drove on the flat tire about 1.25 miles to a gas station with air pump. I inflated to the recommended pressure of 38 psi & drove to a nearby restaurant for a 1 hour meeting. The pressure remained OK. I made it 5 of the 7 miles to my home before the pressure started to drop. It went down to 24. I continued past my street to The Tire Stop. I then saw & felt a metal object which had punctured the tire. I told them it was a self-sealing/run-flat tire. They removed the wheel from the vehicle and the tire from the rim. The technician (inexperienced with self seal tires) felt the sticky layer inside and told me that they could not place a patch. He consulted his supervisor who told him to simply pull out the offending piece of metal. It was neither a nail nor a screw but a 1.5 inch piece of tar-covered steel with a sharp point! He inflated and remounted the tire. (It should be noted that a run-flat tire has extremely stiff sidewalls and requires a very high pressure to pop the tire back on the bead. Usually, a facility requires a "cage" in which to place these tires for inflation. Some tire stores will not handle a run-flat tire because of risk to their employees.) I have monitored the pressure closely ever since but have lost not 1 psi of pressure. I have been driving on it without restriction.
 
#34 ·
I would just make sure the tire was pumped up to the correct pressure and then pull the nail and see what happens. Likely nothing will happen and you'll be good to go. The good news is, you have a built in tire pressure monitor in the Bolt, so you can easily check the status every time you drive. Even if it does turn out to leak a little, no need for a tow truck as it will be a very slow leak. I'm sure that even with the inside sealant goo, a tire shop could still plug it if you really want them to, but it might be a waste of money.
 
#35 ·
I had a low pressure reading on my right rear tire. I pumped it up at home but it kept going down so I took it to a tire store (Discount Tires). They removed the tire from the car and showed me two screws, one next to the other. They said that because they were so close to one another they could not patch the tire. I told them they are supposed to be self sealing so pull the screws out and pump up the tire and put it back on and let's see what happens. It has been about a month now and the tire has held air just fine and runs fine at 80mph+
 
#38 ·
I'm thinking these are self sealing and not run flats. Big difference.
That's right, the tires that come with the Bolt are not run flats - they are self-sealing. If you get a puncture and the self sealing feature doesn't work, you can't continue to drive on them. That's why I'm planning to get a compact spare to carry in the lower cargo compartment.
 
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