[RichCapeCod]

There was a recent thread discussing the potential benefits/utility of using the OEM EVSE with a 110v outlet as opposed to setting up either a 240v outlet with the OEM unit or an aftermarket charger. The discussion somehow became a debate over whether one outlet was either not needed or somehow superior to another.

At any rate, for those interested in such things, I decided to experiment with my factory charger using both level power sources. This is easy for me to do, as I had both levels of outlets (110v and 240v) in close proximity to my Bolt (the 110v outlet was left over from a shed moved from that location. I use it for all my garden implements; lawn mower, hedge trimmer, leaf blower.)

240v Test

I charged the Bolt using the OEM EVSE unit for four hours. The vehicle had just finished a 30 mile round trip. Temperature was around 50 degrees.

Start 122 miles of range
Stop 177 miles of range
55 mile total = 13.75 miles per hour of charge

110v Test
The Bolt was charged, using the same factory unit, for twelve hours. The vehicle had just finished around an 80 mile round trip. Temperature was about 45 degrees (charge was from 7:45PM to 7:45AM).

Start 86 miles of range
Stop 144 miles of range
58 mile total = 4.8 miles per hour of charge

Some comments. First, this was not a “scientific” test. Rather it was an empirical observation on my part, specific to my vehicle's battery temp at the time, air temperature, and the state of my electrical outlets. In other words, YMMV.

I’m sure, if my calculations are off, someone will let me know ASAP! Having said that, I think they are correct. If so, then I am gratified to see that the adapter, permitting me to use a 240v outlet with my standard Bolt charger, gives me a substantial amount of hourly charge. I certainly won’t be in the market for another model charger.

In the spirit of “trust but verify” I’ve attached photos of the start/stop screens of my little experiment.

240v Start

240v End

110v Start

110v End

 

[XJ12]

the Bolt's EVSE works pretty good on 240V. just charged mine last night from 8 bars to 18. plugged in about 7:30 PM. first checked the Bolt by opening the driver's door and it said it would be fully charged by 8:30 AM. My general rough estimate is one bar per hour. Odd that it was predicting 13 hours. Checked it later that evening and it said 8:00 AM. See a trend. Check again and it's 7:30 AM. Early in the morning it was done by 6:30 AM. around 11 hours for roughly 30kWh. Perfect.

Thanks for your update.

 

[hatchy]

Thats smokin fast. I get about 11 miles per hour. About what XJ said.

I've never clocked the 110, but I think its like 4 miles per hour.

 

[wonderbolt]

I am not totally clear on the objective of your test, but just to be clear the metric you measuring is not really valid.

You are using the Bolt range estimate to assess charge rate. That metric varies significantly based on your previous driving conditions, temperature, and driving style. It is not a consistent metric.

The only charge metric that matters is kWh delivered VS charge time. The max the Bolt can charge at with level 2 is the rating of the onboard charger, 7.2kW.

The max your stock EVSE can deliver is 12A at whatever voltage it is connected to. In this case either 240VAC x 12A = 2.88kW or 120VAC x 12A = 1.44kW

If your line voltage sags or is high your actual value could vary by a few %.

 

[redpoint5]

Yeah, I was going to ask what the method of measurement was. The amount delivered to the battery is also less than what comes from the wall. My understanding is that the max rate of charge is based on what is delivered from the wall, not what is put into the battery (which is less).

 

[hatchy]

WonderBolt is right, citing miles clouds things with the guessometer. It looks like from your dash you are about average though. Which means your outlet voltage is probably on the high side. That or you got a fast evse.

 

[RichCapeCod]

I am not totally clear on the objective of your test, but just to be clear the metric you measuring is not really valid. ..........

From my post:

" this was not a “scientific” test. Rather it was an empirical observation on my part, specific to my vehicle's battery temp at the time, air temperature, and the state of my electrical outlets. In other words, YMMV."


I just wanted to see the difference in charge amount between the 110v and 240v. Not a serious "test." Not looking to defend my little experiment. I found it useful. For me. And I thought I'd share.


Some of the guys who gave me a few "likes" seemed to have found if of value. So, I guess, no harm, no foul.


Rich

 

[redpoint5]

I'm always happy when people share a datapoint because stats interest me. That's why I get obsessive about being as precise as possible, but I don't expect people to be as enthusiastic to spend as much time or money gathering that info for the benefit of internet strangers as I might be willing to do.

 

[hatchy]

Same here, internet stranger who appreciates the data point.

 

[ZoomZoom]

From my post:

Some of the guys who gave me a few "likes" seemed to have found if of value. So, I guess, no harm, no foul.

Rich

I almost liked it. It made me laugh, but then I moved my mouse off the button before I clicked.

 

[Raymondjram]

Most Level 1 EVSE relays have two pole (DP) switching, and on 110- 120 VAC they switch on the live (L) line and the neutral (N) lines. For 220-240 VAC, the neutral is replaced by the second live line (L2) added with the first live line (L1), so you get double the power flowing at the same amperage (up to 12 A). It can behave as a Level 2 EVSE. For those EV owners who charge overnight, the charging time is reduced.

 

[Vertiformed]

FWIW, here's what it looks like if you do a test gathering data from the ODB-II port. This is my morning quick charge where all I'd done the day before was my short commute to work. The car claimed to have used 2.5 kWh, the car's charging system thinks it sent 2.684 kWh to the battery during charging, the charging system believes it took 2.828 kWh from the Level-2 charger, and my JuiceBox thinks it sent 2.865 kWh to the car. Thus 1.3% was lost being sent to from the charger to the car, then 5% was lost in converting the power from 240V AC into 385V DC, and then anther 5% or so was lost in the process of charging the battery.

(This was a short charge, which is usually a little less efficient than longer charges.)

Incidentally, this is for hill-top reserve.

 

[RichCapeCod]

Vertiformed, I really do appreciate your knowledge and input of information, but, wow, lots of that material is just over my head!! (graduate degree in criminal justice, not electrical engineering!!)


Rich

 

[hatchy]

I regret that I have but one like to give..

 

[Vertiformed]

Vertiformed, I really do appreciate your knowledge and input of information, but, wow, lots of that material is just over my head!! (graduate degree in criminal justice, not electrical engineering!!)

Remember that on a forum like this, questions are always welcome.

Having the know-how to log data and draw these graphs does require some combination of skills, but the skills needed to interpret them isn't that much.

Electricity needn't be that confusing. Imagine water in a pipe where water that flows through the pipe is like energy delivered. Volts is like the water pressure. Amps is like the width of the pipe. power (usually measured in watts, 1 watt = 1 joule/second) is like flow rate (gallons per minute), and energy (in kWh or joules, 1 kWh = 3600000 joules) is like total water delivered (gallons).

If you want to deliver 1 kWh of energy, you can either have 1000 volts at 1 amp for one hour, or 1 volt at 1000 amps for an hour, or 1000 volts at 1000 amps for 0.001 hours (3.6 seconds).

So, in general, you'd expect charging at 120 volts with 12 amps (and it is 120 usually, not 110) to be about half the speed of charging at 240 volts with 12 amps. It probably won't be quite that bad because of the way it switches from constant current charging to constant voltage charging to finish the charge, which is what causes the drop off in the Watts curve.

 

[RichCapeCod]

Vertiformed, I've seen that analogy (water through the pipe) before. I try to envision just that scenario. All I can think of is, how come nothing dribbles out the end of the wire??


I used to fly helicopters for the NYPD (when I was a child). I was a decent pilot, but don't ask me to explain by what magic those infernal machines manage to stay in the air (helicopter=a combination of miscellaneous parts which happen to be flying in close formation).


Thus, I have learned to permit smart guys to tell me what I have to know!


Rich

 

[redpoint5]

Vertiformed, I've seen that analogy (water through the pipe) before. I try to envision just that scenario. All I can think of is, how come nothing dribbles out the end of the wire??


I used to fly helicopters for the NYPD (when I was a child). I was a decent pilot, but don't ask me to explain by what magic those infernal machines manage to stay in the air (helicopter=a combination of miscellaneous parts which happen to be flying in close formation).


Thus, I have learned to permit smart guys to tell me what I have to know!


Rich

Smart is mostly a function of interest. We spend time on the things that we're more interested in, which is why I'm criminal justice dumb (except for the little amount I learned going to prison).

Electrons do dribble out of the end of a wire when the "valve" is open (a load is connected).

I'd say it takes a lot of smarts to fly a helicopter. How many people know about retreating blade stalls and auto-rotation?

The magic of helicopters is in the swashplate, a simple yet genius concept. I would never have thought of it. My flight inventions would look like those in old videos of contraptions with large screws spinning.

 

[RichCapeCod]

Redpoint5, think of the poor experimenters of 100 years ago trying to figure out why, when the main rotor blades of their early machines were moved so as to fly in one direction, the aircraft wanted to head 90 degrees off to the side! (gyroscopic precession)


Rich

 

[hatchy]

Air blenders are just so wrong. Fixed wing is the only proper way to fly.

Just got my "6-50p" outlet adapter cord made for my 2nd location out of 3. 3rd has a strange four blade round deal. That one next...

 

[Rick CH]

3rd has a strange four blade round deal. That one next...

Looks like a L14-30 receptacle.