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2022 EUV SuperCruise could have killed my wife today

6297 Views 128 Replies 50 Participants Last post by Peter131, 4 mo ago

tomstead

Discussion Starter · 4 mo ago

She was driving at Sunset along the concrete divider on the freeway. Things were fine but then there were some white pylons. The Bolt went towards them. She caught it as the car was hitting the plastic pylons but she over corrected into the other lane. If someone was in that lane it would have been bad. Chevy should pay for our repair but I bet they won’t. Do not use SuperCruise in a low light situation. Maybe don’t use it in any situation. GM should give me my money back on this car.

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Louis Chevrolet

· #2 · 4 mo ago (Edited)

I'm no expert, but from what I've read about Bolt Super Cruise is that the person driving is responsible for everything. Super Cruise driving errors are to be expected. That is why human oversight is required.

While using Super Cruise, driver is to be looking for road changes due to construction, broken down vehicle, police action, pedestrian on highway, etc. because that is a situation that is more difficult for Super Cruise.

Sometimes lighting and/or weather conditions make it harder to see. So we are supposed to slow down then. I haven't used Super Cruise enough to understand how much it struggles with camera sight limitations. The radar should work fine at sunset.

For some people Super Cruise is a valuable feature. For others, it's use could make travel more dangerous. We have freedom to choose for ourselves. Sometimes it will prevent an errant driver from wandering into our lane, and sometimes it will cause it.

Reactions: 5

tomstead

Discussion Starter · #3 · 4 mo ago

This was a simple situation on a straight freeway. There is obviously some bug in the code. One time it tried to veer in a construction zone. I have heard of Teslas doing that too.

InsaneBolt

· #4 · 4 mo ago

Copied straight from Chevy’s website. There is a 0% chance they will pay towards the repair.

Using Super Cruise Responsibly

Super Cruise is a driver assistance technology. Your complete attention is always required while driving. Do not use a mobile device while you are driving, even when Super Cruise is engaged
You will need to take steering control in the following situations when using Super Cruise:
- When encountering unusual traffic situations or objects
- When merging into traffic
- When exiting the highway
- When making a turn or stop for crossing traffic or a traffic light, stop sign or other traffic control device
Super Cruise does not steer to avoid construction zones. Always be ready to take action, and take over steering or apply the brake

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Scruffer

· #5 · 4 mo ago

tomstead said:
She was driving at Sunset along the concrete divider on the freeway. Things were fine but then there were some white pylons. The Bolt went towards them. She caught it as the car was hitting the plastic pylons but she over corrected into the other lane. If someone was in that lane it would have been bad. Chevy should pay for our repair but I bet they won’t. Do not use SuperCruise in a low light situation. Maybe don’t use it in any situation. GM should give me my money back on this car.

You guys that use any type of autonomous driving are the beta testers. No doubt autonomous driving is about inattentive driving.

Reactions: 2

cwerdna

· #6 · 4 mo ago

tomstead said:
This was a simple situation on a straight freeway. There is obviously some bug in the code. One time it tried to veer in a construction zone. I have heard of Teslas doing that too.

Teslas have been known to run into stationary objects and stopped vehicles esp. police cars while on "autopilot" or whatever. As to why, that's another longer discussion that I don't have time to get into.

Too bad the video at Automatic Emergency Braking Failure, the Movie is now private (possibly related to a YouTube change that affected me too but I did watch it before) but he was mentioned at Tesla driver mows down 11 construction cones on video and blames Autopilot. And, Hit a Few Plastic Barrels, Pay Half Your Car's Value was his followup thread.

accelerus

· #7 · 4 mo ago

I love my supercruise - and I've been using it in my new EUV for roughly 4 months. As good as it is, as others here (and GM themselves have said) you have to be paying attention all the time. Those are the rules of the game.

It took me a while to build trust in their system for my commutes, but even still I keep a finger or thumb on the wheel as my hand rests on my leg to "feel" what the car is up to steering wise, and for the instant ability to catch it should it get confused.

Mildly related but last week a big truck was in front of me so I couldn't the object in the road, he swerved to avoid a LARGE ladder that was in the middle of the lane, I had to emergency evade just like him. Swerving hard at 70mph isn't fun, and the only reason I got away with it because I had my hand resting on the wheel even under supercruise.

OP mentions "one time it had to veer in a construction zone" -- based on how the system is designed, you are lucky it veered at all. Since it uses mapped highways, gps, and such having a new lane opened up, a detour or anything that's not mapped should, and will cause the system to disengage. The setup of a particular construction zone can change daily, all the car has to go on is that one time high res map that GM made however long ago.

No offense, but you might need to have a conversation with wifey about correcting in a situation like that. Similar to how people over react, and over correct to avoid an animal on the road who wind up dead from going off road and hitting a telephone pole or something, as a driver you have to be able to make the call to just hit the little white poles (which are designed to break away) vs flying into another lane which may or may not be occupied.

I've used Supercruise at night, in the rain, and all manner of situations -- it's an assistant, nothing more. It's best territory is long straight boring drives, I actually disengage it during some morning commutes if I'm in the highway lane and lots of people are merging, since the system doesn't understand or play nice with people entering the highway.

You won't like hearing any of this I'm sure -- but the simple fact is when using supercruise you have to be paying attention all the time, hand on the wheel, and ready for anything. The same thing that happened to your wife could happen to anyone without supercruise if they took their attention or hands off the wheel for just a few seconds.

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cwerdna

· #8 · 4 mo ago

InsaneBolt said:
Copied straight from Chevy’s website. There is a 0% chance they will pay towards the repair.

Using Super Cruise Responsibly

Super Cruise is a driver assistance technology. Your complete attention is always required while driving. Do not use a mobile device while you are driving, even when Super Cruise is engaged

You will need to take steering control in the following situations when using Super Cruise:

When encountering unusual traffic situations or objects

When merging into traffic

When exiting the highway

When making a turn or stop for crossing traffic or a traffic light, stop sign or other traffic control device

Super Cruise does not steer to avoid construction zones. Always be ready to take action, and take over steering or apply the brake

Thank you. I see the above text at About Super Cruise | Vehicle Support | Chevrolet.

Peter131

· #9 · 4 mo ago

First, I'm very glad your wife is ok.
I love Super Cruise but it requires even more attention than manual driving. I posted a few weeks back that I was driving in the HOV lane and going pretty fast while all the regular lanes were stopped. A car was stopped sticking slightly out into my HOV lane. I saw it and just wondered how Super Cruise would handle it. A big mistake. Super Cruise did not steer around it as I would have. Instead it went right up to the car and then slammed on emergency braking. I was very lucky to avoid an accident.

Super Cruise is not an accident avoidance system. You need to be ready to take control at any time.

Reactions: 3

MikeyBolt

· #10 · 4 mo ago

Glad everyone is OK. That said, the status of ADAS on any car is clear: money talks, meaning it will be true true hands free or "self" driving when the manufacturer takes responsibility for it. Until a manufacturer says they'll be responsible and pay for accidents while ADAS is turned on, YOU are responsible.

IMO the "hands free" part of Super Cruise (and Ford's Blue Cruise) is a mistake if you only offer level 2 autonomy. The car should require a hand on the wheel at all times because even if you are just resting your hand on the wheel, that gives you two cues to what the car is doing (you can see and FEEL steering changes) and more importantly, your hand is already on the wheel so you can intervene quickly. Hands free also encourages you to do things like eat a loaded taco while driving. And then, someone is going to be reluctant to drop a taco in their lap and grab the wheel in time and even if they don't have to think about it, now they have two things to do resulting in a delay: drop the taco and grab the wheel.

Mike

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Peter131

· #11 · 4 mo ago

I have never been in the habit of eating while driving. I know I am in a minority here.

Reactions: 1

PLP

· #12 · 4 mo ago

tomstead said:
She was driving at Sunset along the concrete divider on the freeway. Things were fine but then there were some white pylons. The Bolt went towards them. She caught it as the car was hitting the plastic pylons but she over corrected into the other lane. If someone was in that lane it would have been bad. Chevy should pay for our repair but I bet they won’t. Do not use SuperCruise in a low light situation. Maybe don’t use it in any situation. GM should give me my money back on this car.

so how do you trust it now?

As others mentioned - the DRIVER is responsible for the car. Not "super duper cruise control". Besides, RTFM. It says clearly - you are driving the car. Not some magic hand.

You want to sit and relax?
Buy a plane with Autopilot. And then you will find out that you are still responsible for it....

Sorry man, no pity for you.
I just hate such titles" "My car tried to kill me".

NO!!! It did not. It was You who did not use the car the proper way.

Reactions: 5

Voldar

· #13 · 4 mo ago

tomstead said:
She was driving at Sunset along the concrete divider on the freeway. Things were fine but then there were some white pylons. The Bolt went towards them. She caught it as the car was hitting the plastic pylons but she over corrected into the other lane. If someone was in that lane it would have been bad. Chevy should pay for our repair but I bet they won’t. Do not use SuperCruise in a low light situation. Maybe don’t use it in any situation. GM should give me my money back on this car.

Out of curiosity, what your wife was doing when the car was aiming for the concrete divider ? She couldn't believe her eyes that the car can do that ?!? Be glad your wife is safe, but you should blame her for the situation. I don't have SC in my Bolt EV, but as others already mentioned, it's the responsibility of the driver to adjust and intervene at any moment to correct a situation. Don't just sit like a noob watching your car going towards a concrete wall... one thing is true, it will hit the wall.

Reactions: 3

PLP

· #14 · 4 mo ago

Voldar said:
Don't just sit like a noob watching your car going towards a concrete wall...

That brings me a picture from the Don't look up movie

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Voldar

· #15 · 4 mo ago

tomstead said:
GM should give me my money back on this car.

Sure... we live in a society of "not my fault".

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Voldar

· #16 · 4 mo ago

PLP said:
That brings me a picture from the Don't look up movie

"Don't Look Up" it's unfortunately not a movie, it's a very true depiction of the society we live in... And when the some good people look up, they don't believe what they see anyway, until it hits them.

Reactions: 4

BoltEUV

· #17 · 4 mo ago

I love my Super Cruise and understand fully that it's a cruise control and not self driving. It's a very good cruise control system at that. It reduces the tedium of steering and foot control but at no point does it ever drive for me. Until the car is paying its own insurance and car payment and GM guarantees that I don't have to intervene, it's still another nifty cruise control.

PLP

· #18 · 4 mo ago

But then it goes public, Twitter, FB, or whatever else, and you will find bunch of people who will follow this pattern and start a big fight. Then, you get a PR person who will admit of GM wrongdoing. And then someone will sue the company and some judge will be stupid enough to let this fly, because some lawyer will try to prove that if it says Super Cruise control it should be Super and Super in client’s understanding is self-driving. Apparently, they did not read the manual, or they failed to follow the directions, yet that is never the case.

I am not sure what is wrong with people, but more and more often they try to blame someone else for their own mistakes or failures.

That is just like “going too fast”. Nope, it is not going too fast. It is not slowing down early enough. It is not keeping the distance between cars. It is the phone in your hand, it is the bald tires, and 1 mm thick brake pads. But let’s blame someone else instead.

tomstead

Discussion Starter · #19 · 4 mo ago

I agree that it is the responsibility of the driver etc. When you are driving along a concrete barrier it is beyond a normal persons reaction time to correct the car. We are talking about two or three feet. Milliseconds. Her hands were not on the wheel because that is how the system works. It is also one thing to be attentive and another thing to react when the Supercruise messes up and steers at a wall. One of the replies mentioned that keeping you hands off of the wheel slows reaction time. If you look at Chevy’s adds you see the guy with his hands on his knees. Finally the term “wifey” is sexist and derogatory. I am just warning everyone to keep your hands on the wheel or not use Supercruise at all. We paid good money for Beta software.

Reactions: 3

tomstead

Discussion Starter · #20 · 4 mo ago

I agree that SuperCruise is not an accident avoidance system but is should not be an accident creation system. This has never happened to either of us in normal driving. Companies are risking people’s lives to test their Beta software. Recently on the Bay Bride Tesla autopilot slammed the brakes on for no reason and caused a 6 car pile up.

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