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Discussion Starter #1
This is a summery of the posts I have made over the past couple weeks, with a comparison to cost of doing the same trip in my Miata.

Totals for the trip from Lepanto, AR to Chandler, AZ. I did the trip west at the speed limit. Details of weather and other relevant info are in the detailed daily posts.

Day one total miles covered this day was 486.1 using 140.1 kWh averaging 3.5 m/kWh. Total cost was $26.18 for $.05 per mile

Day two total miles covered this day was 418 miles, using 142.6 kWh averaging 2.9 m/kWh. Total cost was $25.24 for $.06 per mile

Side trip to Carlsbad Caverns Total miles covered 216 using 51.8 kWh averaging 4.2 m/kWh. Total cost was $0.00 for $.00 per mile.

Day three total miles covered this day was 622.8 miles, using 190.5 kWh averaging 3.3 m/kWh. Total cost was $45.67 for $.07 per mile

Recap of full trip west: Total miles including doing Carlsbad Caverns, 1741.9 using 525 kWh (including power for trip to Carlsbad Caverns) averaging 3.3 m/kWh. Total cost was $97.09 for $.06 per mile.

We did 110 miles of driving around in the Chandler AZ area, not sure of energy consumption, but cost was zero. This was all around town driving, so a conservative estimate would be 5 m/kWh for total of 22 kWh used.

For the trip home from Chandler, AZ to Lepanto, AR. I did the trip east at 5 mph over the speed limit for the most part, details of weather and other relevant info are in the detailed daily posts.

Day one Total miles covered this day was 624.0 miles, using 173.2 kWh averaging 3.6 m/kWh. Total cost was $40.23 for $.06 per mile

Day two Total miles covered this day was 417.6 miles, using 134.1 kWh averaging 3.1 m/kWh. Total cost was $22.90 for $.05 per mile.

Day three Total miles covered this day was 500.0 miles, using 142.6 kWh averaging 3.5 m/kWh. Total cost was $22.40 including my home charging up to HTR for a cost of $.05 per mile

Recap of full trip East: Total miles 1,541 using 449.9 kWh averaging 3.4 m/kWh. Total cost was $85.53 for $.06 per mile



Recap of round trip: Total miles (including side trip to Carlsbad Caverns in NM, around town driving in Chandler AZ) 3,237 miles using 996.9 kWh including energy used for side trip to Carlsbad Caverns and estimated consumption for around town diving in Chandler AZ for an average of 3.25 m/kWh and a total cost of $182.62 for $.056 per mile. That is 5.6 cents per mile including free charging at hotels and our friends house in Chandler AZ.

In the 2012 Miata a slightly more direct route (including side trip and around town driving) would have been 3,126 miles, at a cost of $.10 per mile for gas… so $312.60 instead of $182.62, so our energy cost savings were $129.98 for this trip over the cost of driving a 30 mpg car at my local (low price in rural Arkansas) gas prices.

Later,



Keith
 

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Keith how did You get around places like Carlsbad? did You have to bring chargers and stay at RV parks? Not a lot of DCFC or even L2s out there unless plugshare is out of date.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Keith how did You get around places like Carlsbad? did You have to bring chargers and stay at RV parks? Not a lot of DCFC or even L2s out there unless plugshare is out of date.
I drove to Carlsbad caverns visitor center (different than the town of Carlsbad) parked the car while we explored the caverns, and then drove back to the Hotel where I hooked up to the Tesla destination charger with my Tesla Tap. Did this all on 1 full charge, so no need to charge up at the caverns.

I figured I could do it just by plotting out the distance and elevation in plugshare, and then plugged in the info in ABRP to see if it agreed with my assessment... it did so I went on my merry way :)

Later,

Keith

PS: If we had taken the Bolt to the Grand Canyon instead of our friends minivan, we would have had to charge once along the way, and then L2 charge for a few hours at the Canyon while taking in the sites before starting the drive back to Chandler AZ, and stopping to charge once on the way back. In addition to the extra time, if we took the Bolt someone would have had to ride on the roof... 5 adults and a baby don't fit in the Bolt :D
 

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You can get a Tesla tap or J-dapter on Amazon. Get the one Tony Williams makes.
Any of these will work fine. Pick the one you prefer.



 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thanks for the summary. How did you pass the time while charging?
Most of my charging stops were in the 40 min range, 5 min walk into Walmart, 5 min in the bathroom, and 5 min walk back to the car (most EA stations are in a remote part of the parking lot... helps avoid ICEing) leaves you with 25 min to kill... I just play on my phone for 25 min and then hit the road. On a couple stops we would usually plan on having a meal. You have to eat, and doing so on a charge break passes the time. On the one stop that was excessively long in each direction, I pulled out the laptop and the wife and I watched a 45 min episode of something on Amazon prime streaming video while we ate a meal in the car, and played on the phone for a bit. That stretch between Deming NM and Benson AZ now has a station in the middle at Lordsburg NM, so our next trip out west (next summer) will shave an hour off of the trip in each direction. That station opened up 4 days after my return trip to Arkansas!

I did an analysis on various cars in a theoretical 800 mile trip, and found that the Tesla Model 3 is comparable in average speed to a gas powered car if you do driving legs of 200 miles or less, just an hour more on trip time than a gas car. That gives you charging breaks long enough to have a family bathroom break, but not any longer than a real world family would take a break for after 200 miles of driving. This is based on the gas car doing a speed run with 5 min stops at gas stations and no breaks... pee in a bottle and keep on driving! So in a real world situation it would be less than an hour added to the trip in a Tesla Model 3. I just wish I didn't hate having all the controls on a touch screen! If they gave me some conventional buttons and controls in the model 3 I would probably have been a Tesla fanboy by now.

This thought experiment lets me know that I can be happy with any new EV coming out that has 75 kWh or more and charges at 150 KW or more up to at least 50% with gradual taper after 50%... that is all it takes to make a good road trip EV that is comparable to a gas car. The only people that need ultra fast DCFC are people who don't have at home charging, and just want to do a 5 min "splash and dash" charge. The cars that need ultra fast DCFC are the less expensive ones that are affordable enough for people who live in apartments or homes without garage space for L2 charging. But I suspect that the only cars that will get ultra fast DCFC will be high end luxury EV's destined for affluent owners with easy access to home charging.

Such is life!

Keith
 

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Thanks for the response. I did a calculation for a 600 mile trip that said a Bolt will take 2 hours longer than an ICE car and a Tesla will take 1 hour longer.
 

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Keith,

This is an excellent series of posts on your trip and the responses. This is the kind of info that's helpful for those who have yet to make the leap to a long-range EV.

Keep em coming. ;)

Paul
 

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Headed to OK fm SoCal for T'giving. 3 days out and 3 days back for planning, Has anyone used the 'Plan Your Route' feature on the Chevy app? I plan to try it out. See if it accounts for elevation changes at least. Climbing 6000' fm Phoenix to Flagstaff. Anthem AZ has a DCFC just N. of Phoenix. Then 113 miles to the city of trains!
 

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Thanks for the response. I did a calculation for a 600 mile trip that said a Bolt will take 2 hours longer than an ICE car and a Tesla will take 1 hour longer.
The real numbers on the Bolt are likely to be longer, unless you're driving mostly flat roads, under 50mph. Even if you start at 100% and end at 0%, that basically requires an average charge rate of 45KW. Possible, but unlikely. See e.g. https://www.chevybolt.org/threads/theoretical-vs-real-world-fast-charging.34259/#post-525090
 

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The real numbers on the Bolt are likely to be longer, unless you're driving mostly flat roads, under 50mph. Even if you start at 100% and end at 0%, that basically requires an average charge rate of 45KW. Possible, but unlikely. See e.g. https://www.chevybolt.org/threads/theoretical-vs-real-world-fast-charging.34259/#post-525090
We normally stop and stretch our legs, etc when we make this drive in and ICE car. I assumed we would do the same with the Bolt and use that time to charge. Of course that's still not enough charging time, which is how I calculated 2 hours additional time than an ICE car. So the total charging time is longer than 2 hours, but the trip takes 2 hours longer than an ICE car. Make sense?
 

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Headed to OK fm SoCal for T'giving. 3 days out and 3 days back for planning, Has anyone used the 'Plan Your Route' feature on the Chevy app? I plan to try it out. See if it accounts for elevation changes at least. Climbing 6000' fm Phoenix to Flagstaff. Anthem AZ has a DCFC just N. of Phoenix. Then 113 miles to the city of trains!
I use Energy Assist — Plan Your Route, especially coupled with CarPlay. It's usually very good at estimating what your battery level will be when you arrive at your destination and so it's way better than the Guess-O-Meter for answering the vital “Will I make it to my next stop?” question.

But for route planning with charging stops, I usually deploy more tools than Energy Assist alone, because it doesn't always have the best info on chargers (although you can teach it about additional chargers for a given route) or suggest the most optimal route for charging. So, a good extra source is abetterrouteplanner.com, but even there, I like to verify the charging stops suggested with PlugShare.
 

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Headed to OK fm SoCal for T'giving. 3 days out and 3 days back for planning, Has anyone used the 'Plan Your Route' feature on the Chevy app? I plan to try it out. See if it accounts for elevation changes at least. Climbing 6000' fm Phoenix to Flagstaff. Anthem AZ has a DCFC just N. of Phoenix. Then 113 miles to the city of trains!
I did a review of the app. It's somewhere on this forum. I also compared it to other apps. It does account for elevation change in the planning feature. However, I don't use it anymore: too cumbersome, and often simply doesn't work. I use A Better Routeplanner. My review of it should be on this forum as well. It also includes elevation changes. Typically the error is under 10% which is where I want it to be. ;)

Paul
 

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I did a review of the app. It's somewhere on this forum. I also compared it to other apps. It does account for elevation change in the planning feature. However, I don't use it anymore: too cumbersome, and often simply doesn't work. I use A Better Routeplanner. My review of it should be on this forum as well. It also includes elevation changes. Typically the error is under 10% which is where I want it to be. ;)

Paul
Yup, if you look at my individual days of my trip, I give the estimate from ABRP vs the observed reality and in good weather it was usually pretty close. In windy areas it was significantly off because I plan my trips a few days to a few weeks in advance, so I don't put "headwind" into my ABRP trip plans. I think next time I will just put a 10 mph headwind if traveling West... can you put a negative number into headwind? If so I will use -10mph headwind when traveling east.

Later,

Keith
 

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Are you logging the data in ABRP so they can get the feedback? I did it on the trip to Death Valley but that's one of the few times it worked for me--the logging that is.

Paul
 
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