Would anyone else like to pile on? My treat!
A little confused about these kW numbers, please help clarify for me.
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Too Funny. I am with you, Zapster. The layman will understand if you said 50 cents per kw. Its like like saying $3.59 per gallon.
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I am little conflicted with this approach. Let me explain why. The gasoline is used for more than 150 years already, and everyone knows that the gallon is a unit of volume. So yes, $3.59 per gallon, anyone knows what it means.
But the electric cars are new on the nowadays roads. And people aren't all "savy" about kW, kWh, what one is and what the other means. This is why it is good to remind people that kWh is a unit of capacity and kW is a unit of power. You charge in kW and your battery has x kWh capacity. Yes, if you charge during an hour at a constant power of 5 kW, your battery received 5 kWh but...
It is explicitly not that. It's the equivalent of saying $3.59 per gallon per hour. It's nonsensical.
Just because humans are good at interpreting incorrect information via context clues doesn't mean that saying something that's complete nonsense should be acceptable.
ga2500ev
Well, there's another pedant's day brightened. I will have to post complete nonsense more often!
To the OP: Please be aware that some people on this forum have NO IDEA what you mean when you confuse kW and kWh. Most of us can figure it out from context, but some people just really can't figure it out, no matter how obvious it is. For those people's sake, let's try to get those units right. EVs are new to many of us (well, pretty much all of us), but we are expected to get these things right no matter what... so that we don't confuse those who have trouble figuring these things out from context. I'm sure these people are not trying to make you feel stupid, because that would make them bad people... and I'm sure they are not bad people. They are just really bad at picking up on context in a conversation. So, on that note, let me just say this:
Kilowatts are a measure of power, while kilowatt hour is a measure of energy. An easier way to think of this is like water flowing into a glass. Kilowatt is like the rate at which the water is flowing, whereas kilowatt hour is the amount of water in the glass. So, power flows into your batter in kilowatts, but your battery holds kilowatt hours of energy. Now we can get on to your real question, and the answer you are looking for.
NOTE: DC fast chargers are honest to goodness chargers, whereas your home "charger" is really just a somewhat smart cord that sends power to the [actual] charger that is onboard your car -- much like the little USB block you plug into the wall to charge your phone is not really a charger... is is just a power supply that feeds the charging circuit inside of your phone. However, as more ordinary (non-EV geeks) drive EVs, level 2 equipment will just start to become popularly known as "chargers." But, if you don't want to anger the easily confused EV geeks, you can call them EVSEs (electric vehicle service equipment).
Kilowatts are a measure of power, while kilowatt hour is a measure of energy. An easier way to think of this is like water flowing into a glass. Kilowatt is like the rate at which the water is flowing, whereas kilowatt hour is the amount of water in the glass. So, power flows into your batter in kilowatts, but your battery holds kilowatt hours of energy. Now we can get on to your real question, and the answer you are looking for.
- 11kW is the rate at which you can charge at home on 240v power. There are also public charging stations that use 240v power, and these are often called level 2 or L2 stations or "destination chargers."
- 55kW is the rate that the Bolt can charge on a DC fast charger. These are the ~400 volt DC (direct current) chargers that send juice straight to the battery using those extra connectors that are beneath the orange cover in the charger door of your Bolt. These are the ones you typically find out on the highways, but also around town.
NOTE: DC fast chargers are honest to goodness chargers, whereas your home "charger" is really just a somewhat smart cord that sends power to the [actual] charger that is onboard your car -- much like the little USB block you plug into the wall to charge your phone is not really a charger... is is just a power supply that feeds the charging circuit inside of your phone. However, as more ordinary (non-EV geeks) drive EVs, level 2 equipment will just start to become popularly known as "chargers." But, if you don't want to anger the easily confused EV geeks, you can call them EVSEs (electric vehicle service equipment).
Can you please provide additional information for those of us who have learned, apparently incorrectly, that Level 3 is DCFC?
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Please see attached screenshot.
This shows that I can charge there for $0.50/hour. Either L2 or L3, same price?
There have been several threads about it in this forum alone, but I think this one should be worth a look:
Level 3 charging as DCFC, the takeover
@cwerdna sorry for your loss. https://arstechnica.com/cars/2022/07/the-ars-technica-guide-to-electric-vehicle-charging/?utm_source=pocket-newtab That would be ars, saying: . But they're useful if you need to drive farther than your battery's range or if you don't have the ability to charge at...
www.chevybolt.org
Looking at the address in the Google Maps, I notice that there are two types of chargers available in the parking lot. The big one is likely the DC fast charger (DCFC) and the slim one is the AC "Level 2 (L2)" charger.
Bolt EV/EUV can do up to 55kW on DCFC, and 11kW (or 7kW on older model years) on L2. So the maximum charging speed is wildly dependent on the type of charger you use.
I don't use PlugShare (the flag on my profile is a dead giveaway) but if the "$0.50 per hour" is applicable to both types of chargers then it'd be better to use the DCFC since you'll be able to get much more energy into the car for the same cost. But somehow, I doubt that it's that cheap. You (or others with PlugShare account / access to the charger) need to check for more information.
Bolt EV/EUV can do up to 55kW on DCFC, and 11kW (or 7kW on older model years) on L2. So the maximum charging speed is wildly dependent on the type of charger you use.
I don't use PlugShare (the flag on my profile is a dead giveaway) but if the "$0.50 per hour" is applicable to both types of chargers then it'd be better to use the DCFC since you'll be able to get much more energy into the car for the same cost. But somehow, I doubt that it's that cheap. You (or others with PlugShare account / access to the charger) need to check for more information.
I see at Denny's Delano | PlugShare a reference to EV Connect (New Electric Vehicle Fast Chargers Now Available Along State Highways in Central California | Caltrans). You may have to use their app to see accurate pricing. I just took a look at their app.
It looks like there are 2 J1772 handles and it claims 7.2 kW (it's possible it's slightly off, not clear if they account for 208 vs. 240 volts) which are 50 cents per hour.
It also lists two dual handle 50 kW DC FCs and it's $2 per hour. You can also get hit with $1/hour idle fees.
Since you mention Delano, I HAVE charged my former Bolt at Delano Maintenance Station | PlugShare before, which has two FREE DC FCs. Used them during my road trip between Nor Cal and So Cal in Dec 2021. I took highway 99. They are part of New Electric Vehicle Fast Chargers Now Available Along State Highways in Central California | Caltrans. Those guys will NOT go above 50 kW though.
One unit worked fine. The other one worked except its LCD was totally out. The hardware stop button didn't work nor was I able to stop charging by pushing pretty hard on the CCS handle's trigger. I didn't want to break it as it didn't feel a two stage button that would ramp down charging then release. I had to press stop on my former Bolt's infotainment system.
If I had my Niro EV, I wouldn't even want to try it since it has no stop button I can find.
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"11kW is the rate at which you can charge at home on 240v power"
Should read as disclaimer. If one has a car with a 11kW charger then they might be able to charge near that rate. There is a number of variables that affect that number.
I prefer Level 3 too. It just upsets some folks to no end. Level 3, level 3, level 3. hahhahaa
Should read as disclaimer. If one has a car with a 11kW charger then they might be able to charge near that rate. There is a number of variables that affect that number.
I prefer Level 3 too. It just upsets some folks to no end. Level 3, level 3, level 3. hahhahaa
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There are two ways to charge a battery :
- using AC
- using DC
DC fast charging IS NOT a level of AC, thus the use of L3 name is wrong.
I hope I made it simpler for everyone to understand.
P.S. I find myself sometimes using the L3 naming when I talk about DCFC. This doesn’t mean I am right, only shows I am human.
If you want to be really technical, there is only ONE way to charge a battery: DC. AC must first be converted to DC before it can be used to charge a battery.
The "Level 3" nomenclature is not necessarily incorrect. SAE defines Level 1 and Level 2 charging standards for both AC and DC charging, but because SAE does not define Level 3 charging standards, doesn't make the colloquial reference to DC Fast Charging as "Level 3" incorrect. It's just not referring to an established SAE standard.
There are currently three different Level 3 (DC Fast Charging) standards: Tesla, CCS, and Chademo. However, the industry has adopted the "Level 3" moniker to apply to all three of these competing standards - basically any DC Fast Charger will be referred to as a "Level 3" on the street.
SAE Level 2 DC charging is the most similar to current non-SAE Level 3 charging. SAE defines Level 2 DC charging as anywhere between 50 and 1000VDC up to 400A.
Indeed.
I also didn't know, but recently learned, that there are also apparently religious beliefs surrounding the SAE and Chademo connectors. Boggles the mind.
Yes, OP can look at top of 3 Factors that Determine Electric Car Charging Times. The max J1772 station delivery rate must also be at least 11 kW. Basically, you need an EVSE that can output 48 amps and advertise that via its pilot signal (Basics of SAE J1772). 240 volts * 48 amps = 11,520 watts = 11.52 kW.
Re: stopping SAE Combo/CCS1 chargers, see PSA: On CCS1/SAE Combo DC chargers, best to stop the.... Whether you can stop them via their SAE Combo handle varies...
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