Chevy Bolt EV Forum banner

21 - 40 of 47 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
361 Posts
This is a great idea! Sure would be useful when Pacific Graft and Extortion shut power off. Too bad our cars don't support V2G/H.
I posted this over at "TMC" and MNL.

-- begin --
I'm in Vegas for CES. I spoke to these guys at their booth yesterday.

It's not shipping in the US yet. They told me that it still requires a connection to the grid. It won't help in an outage in its current form. I mentioned I'm PG&E-land and already experienced two "PSPS". The guy told me the reason is that if you have no grid power and let's say you turn on an oven. Suddenly, there's a huge jump in demand and CHAdeMO doesn't let you do have that sudden sharp increase. I don't recall if the words he used were that it has to be a ramp up or in steps.

It's something they want to work on addressing. I recall him saying that many folks either wanted the outage protection or mention PG&E PSPS.

So, for now, it's only useful cases where you might want to store power from the grid at cheaper rates or use during more expensive periods. Or, (IIRC), it can be useful for those who want to store excess solar energy.
-- end --

We did talk about the situation of CHAdeMO vs CCS in the US. They said they do their testing using Leaf. I mentioned Teslas and their CHAdeMO adapter. According to the guy at the booth, pulling power via CHAdeMO from a Tesla doesn't work. I said to the guy I guess Tesla didn't bother implementing that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,635 Posts
My
It's not shipping in the US yet. They told me that it still requires a connection to the grid.
My neighbor has 7 kW of PV, a 2019, 40 kWh Leaf, and a lead acid battery backup. His off grid power is cleaner AC than the grid provides. This thing would work in his situation.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
681 Posts
Do You all think if we want a GM branded EV we will need a "BEV 3" platformed car that has OTA update abilities or do You think that the bi-directional V2G or V2H is something not supported by the current CCS hardware?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,635 Posts
Do You all think if we want a GM branded EV we will need a "BEV 3" platformed car that has OTA update abilities or do You think that the bi-directional V2G or V2H is something not supported by the current CCS hardware?
I would be very surprised if the problem was hardware. The DC port in the car has two fat wires running to a contactor at the front of the HPDM. From there it probably goes though a busbar to the contactor at the back of the HPDM, and from there through the two fat wires to the contactors in the battery pack...Whew! Somewhere along that path is a current sensor talking to the computers. The tricky part is the low voltage communication between all the contactors, and the computers that run them. When you plug in the DC charger cord, the DC charger talks to the computers through the little communication pins in the port. The computer tells the appropriate contactors to close so that current can flow from the DC charger to the battery. The computers also tell the DC charger how much current to deliver. Now if they were programmed to allow current to flow in the opposite direction out the port, and not open the contactors and throw a bunch of codes, we should be good to go. So the Society of Automotive Engineers, responsible for coming up with the CCS standard in the first place, needs to talk to the utilities, or whatever association represents them. They just need to all agree on a standard communication protocol, which shouldn't take any longer than settling the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
681 Posts
I also watched the YouTube video about it and the Wall box rep mentioned a need to have the EV manufacturer agree that the use of the wall box unit doesn't void their warranty - sounds like that's another discussion slowing things down.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,805 Posts
Meanwhile, the rest of the world moves on with V2G...

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
681 Posts
Watched the video - interesting they are doing this in UK. I did notice the unit seemed larger than the one featured in CES 2020. I notice the Utility mentioned around $750 USD savings which is good! Also I googled ovo energy but couldn't find out if they too are using silicon carbide tech.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,805 Posts
Yeah, let's ignore the most obvious solution... dirt cheap EV rate plus incentive to leave EV plugged in all times (except when driving, of course).

What Would It Take for the US to Become an Energy Storage Manufacturing Powerhouse?

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,805 Posts
... wonder if this DC Home Charger will improve Nissan Leaf sales... $4K for this bi-directional DC charger, plus $38K for long range Leaf minus $7500 tax credit... so you get a $35-36K 60KWh "Powerwall". haha
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,805 Posts
An old article back in Jan 2019. Would be nice if V1G controlled charging include getting free charging power during excess power/negative power pricing periods. ;)

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
614 Posts
Discussion Starter #31
I couldn't care less about V2G. I want V2H, for backup of the 3rd-world electricity in Portland, Oregon. I'm a mile from downtown Portland, and I've had three multi-day outages in seven years.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,575 Posts
I couldn't care less about V2G. I want V2H, for backup of the 3rd-world electricity in Portland, Oregon. I'm a mile from downtown Portland, and I've had three multi-day outages in seven years.
Yup. I'm in So. CA suburbia and have had many multi-hour, and a few multi-day outages in the past decade. I'd have lost freezer food a couple of times without my battery backed up PV system.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
I couldn't care less about V2G. I want V2H, for backup of the 3rd-world electricity in Portland, Oregon. I'm a mile from downtown Portland, and I've had three multi-day outages in seven years.
West Hills, in the woods maybe?

Regardless, it's pretty cheap and easy to tap into the current Bolt for small loads (fridges, lighting, electronics, etc). It won't cover everything in your house, but still very useful in "emergency" situations...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,532 Posts
"… V2G will be trialed in select markets, and won't be available broadly for probably at least 20 years."
And you can see the future, ignore the rate of progress, and prognosticate that, how, exactly?
BTW, this isn't just V2G tech, it is also a great competitor for the wildly costly Tesla Powerwall (which doesn't do V2G), with four times the capacity at around a third of the cost. Personally I couldn't care less about V2G, I just want backup for the frequent lengthy outages here in PDX, and this is far less costly than a generator.
It's fun to consider the current state of things and offer a guess. The V2G capability is way more valuable than a backup source of power. Generators can be had for a couple hundred bucks, so that's not really a problem needing a solution. The big problems needing a solution is the intermittency of renewable energy, which require a storage solution, and the other problem is smoothing peak demands, which are much more costly than base production. Electricity could cost much less if those 2 problems were solved, and V2G has the potential to largely address those problems.

Big changes to infrastructure takes large amounts of time. Considering the number of stakeholders involved in such a project, and the slow EV growth, I expect 20 years is my optimistic prognostication.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,805 Posts
It's fun to consider the current state of things and offer a guess. The V2G capability is way more valuable than a backup source of power. Generators can be had for a couple hundred bucks, so that's not really a problem needing a solution. The big problems needing a solution is the intermittency of renewable energy, which require a storage solution, and the other problem is smoothing peak demands, which are much more costly than base production. Electricity could cost much less if those 2 problems were solved, and V2G has the potential to largely address those problems.

Big changes to infrastructure takes large amounts of time. Considering the number of stakeholders involved in such a project, and the slow EV growth, I expect 20 years is my optimistic prognostication.
The secret with renewable energy total dominance is a cross country super high voltage transmission line. Wind power will shared from wind farms in the waters of east coast, wind from the midwest, and waters of west coast. Solar power will be shared from solar farms installed all across the USA, providing solar power pretty much 12-18 hours a day (winter vs summer).

... and at scale and at the right locations, floating wind turbine can reduce strength of storms!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,635 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
160 Posts
V2H. It is nice to have back up power in rare black out occasions. To back up the whole house, like a full size generator, it requires a transfer switch. So it needs to be a DCFC charger installed in close vicinity of the main panel. It is quite a significant upgrade from L2 chargers most EV owners have. It may help balancing between peak and off-peak rates. But the savings is about a few dollars a day the way we use electricity. Not worth it.

V2G. A pipe dream no less. Most people drive to work, and most of them don't get to hook up to chargers all day long. Say we have all that connectivities in place. How does it work? I charge my car at home overnight to 100%. During the day I dump the charge back to grid to help out the peak demand. So I will end up having less mileage by plugging in. All that is at the expense of the battery life. Any sane person would do that unless he is getting paid?

-TL

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,635 Posts
V2H. It is nice to have back up power in rare black out occasions....Not worth it.
What would you consider "worth it" for running water/internet/food during a pandemic?

The onboard charger in The Tesla Model 3/Y, and the Bolt, are good for 7 kW of power. Here in central Virginia we get a few power outages each year. Not a problem in the winter, as we have LPG heat. During the heat of summer, it could cost us some frozen food. During the pandemic, replacing that frozen food may not be possible, or safe. That is why I am thinking of getting one of these for a grand.


I'd much rather I could pull silent, clean power from our car.

We have used 11 kWh in the last 24 hours.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,131 Posts
V2H. It is nice to have back up power in rare black out occasions. To back up the whole house, like a full size generator, it requires a transfer switch. So it needs to be a DCFC charger installed in close vicinity of the main panel. It is quite a significant upgrade from L2 chargers most EV owners have. It may help balancing between peak and off-peak rates. But the savings is about a few dollars a day the way we use electricity. Not worth it.
I'm debating putting in solar this year for the 26% tax credit. Looking into getting the dcbel from Ossiaco. Since you already need an inverter for solar, this combines that need with a DCFC for V2H. About $7K for the unit with a J1772 and a CCS connector. May have to hack the Bolt to actually provide power thru the CCS. Started socializing the need with my wife. I'm on thin ice with just putting in a ground source heat pump last year. Now that I'm almost all electric, the solar is the way to go in my mind. Get solar and have my own DCFC. Win win.
 
21 - 40 of 47 Posts
Top