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Bolt vs Mini SE electric

7807 Views 58 Replies 18 Participants Last post by greendave, Jul 12, 2020

greendave

Discussion Starter · Apr 22, 2020

Due to the lockdown in California, I've not been able to get out and test-drive the new Mini SE electric. It's unlikely that it could replace the Bolt for me because of the limited range, but from the reviews/photos so far, it seems to have a lot going for it:

Hatchback profile. 6 inches lower than the Bolt.
Tuned for launches. Good OEM tires. Stability control that kicks in and prevents wheelspin from a stop.
Moonroof option. Definitely miss that in the Bolt.
Aesthetics. I'm not wholly sold on the Mini's styling but the mini-CUV look of the Bolt is definitely a turnoff for me.
Price. The Mini starts at $30K, so $20.5K in California after incentives. Even with current dealer rebates, that's a decent bit less than the Bolt.

The SE obviously has two big disadvantages:

Range. 110 miles (more realistically 120 miles) is quite limiting. One thing that might help a bit for long trips is that DCFC doesn't taper below 50kW until 80%, but that's still only ~90 miles of range (in 35 minutes).
Two doors and four seatbelts.

My feeling is that overall the Mini will handle better and be more fun to drive, but it'll be a while before I can test that hunch...

21 - 40 of 59 Posts

rodhx

· #21 · Apr 26, 2020

Packard V8 said:
However, let's be objective; JMHO, but I can't find any content in the Mini which might be considered "much more premium" than the Bolt; examples, please. Again, being objective, I find after a side-by-side comparison the i3 has much higher quality of material, fit, finish and content than the Mini. As to "weird", some of us are all in favor of it.

jack vines

Wow...I knew I shouldn't have tried to help by clarifying that "platform" mistake. Some folks on this board make posting as fraught as boards on politics, religion, or oil changes.

Other than that, I simply replied to your subjective post "Why not just buy a used i3; one with much higher content and trim than the Mini would seem to have", which indicates you have no experience with a current Mini, with my own opinion based on experience with all three vehicles in question. Again, so much for trying to help the OP. And I have no idea why what I may or may not think of as "sporty" has anything to do with the post you quoted.

As far as "my money, my car, my decision" go I obviously chose a Bolt as it best fits my needs. I shopped the i3 but they don't work for me for much the same reason the Mini SE does not. If electric range was higher I would choose either BMW product. As I said before they are both just nicer places to spend time, subjectively of course.

Bolt vs Mini examples? The seat construction & materials and the dash/trim/other interior bits really make the Bolt pale in comparison. The narrow Bolt seats & the hard armrests can make comfort a challenge whereas the Mini is available with those fantastic BMW sport seats. That's an opinion btw.

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Packard V8

· #22 · Apr 26, 2020

rodhx said:
Wow...I knew I shouldn't have tried to help by clarifying that "platform" mistake. Some folks on this board make posting as fraught as boards on politics, religion, or oil changes.

Other than that, I simply replied to your subjective post "Why not just buy a used i3; one with much higher content and trim than the Mini would seem to have", which indicates you have no experience with a current Mini, with my own opinion based on experience with all three vehicles in question. Again, so much for trying to help the OP. And I have no idea why what I may or may not think of as "sporty" has anything to do with the post you quoted.
First, I do have extensive experience with the Mini, i3 and the Bolt, but I did qualify it with "seem", being willing to be shown what I may have missed.

First, I do have extensive experience with the Mini, i3 and the Bolt, but I did qualify it with "seem", being willing to be shown what I may have missed.

And yes, I'll grant you the BMW seats, but then a bolstered sport seat may be better in vigorous driving or on long highway stints, a lower seating position and the big bolsters can be a negative for daily errand running with multiple in-and-outs. Where the Bolt always wins is the one-pedal.

Bottom line for us is the Bolt was best all around and we bought the additional range. After three years, even in winter, we learned the i3 would have sufficient range for our use and maybe today we'd have chosen a lease-return i3 for less money.

A FWIW, here on a BEV forum, the i3 with REx doesn't have many fans, but over on the i3 forum, those who have it are vociferous in defending the REx benefits. They wail and gnash teeth that the REx option has been phased out. We'd have chosen to go without it; BEV all the way.

jack vines

rodhx

· #23 · Apr 26, 2020

Agreed...I have/had no interest in a REX i3.

LectricBill

· #24 · Apr 26, 2020

Since our Bolt is our only car, carrying capacity was high on our list.
The Bolt cargo space, with rear seats folded is 56.6 cu. ft.
Matt Schumaker's video about the Mini says it is 34 cu. ft.
Quite a difference.

Packard V8

· #25 · Apr 27, 2020

LectricBill said:
Since our Bolt is our only car, carrying capacity was high on our list.
The Bolt cargo space, with rear seats folded is 56.6 cu. ft.
Matt Schumaker's video about the Mini says it is 34 cu. ft.
Quite a difference.

For true. The Bolt cargo space is marginal for a once-a-month Costco trip. If the Mini actually has 66% less cargo space than the Bolt, that would be a deal-breaker for us.

jack vines

Fivedoor

· #26 · Apr 27, 2020

Packard V8 said:
First, I do have extensive experience with the Mini, i3 and the Bolt, but I did qualify it with "seem", being willing to be shown what I may have missed.

And yes, I'll grant you the BMW seats, but then a bolstered sport seat may be better in vigorous driving or on long highway stints, a lower seating position and the big bolsters can be a negative for daily errand running with multiple in-and-outs. Where the Bolt always wins is the one-pedal.

Bottom line for us is the Bolt was best all around and we bought the additional range. After three years, even in winter, we learned the i3 would have sufficient range for our use and maybe today we'd have chosen a lease-return i3 for less money.

A FWIW, here on a BEV forum, the i3 with REx doesn't have many fans, but over on the i3 forum, those who have it are vociferous in defending the REx benefits. They wail and gnash teeth that the REx option has been phased out. We'd have chosen to go without it; BEV all the way.

jack vines

rodhx said:
Agreed...I have/had no interest in a REX i3.

The problem is that the North American REX was NERFed to the point of being virtually useless compared to Europe... I hate the styling of the i3, so it makes no difference to me on purchasing choice, but if you get an i3 REX and do a software upgrade to the Euro-spec software the car is much more usable on longer range trips where use of the REX is required.

Keith

GetOffYourGas

· #27 · Apr 27, 2020

2

Packard V8 said:
For true. The Bolt cargo space is marginal for a once-a-month Costco trip. If the Mini actually has 66% less cargo space than the Bolt, that would be a deal-breaker for us.

jack vines

How many people are you feeding? I find the Bolt more than satisfactory for a one-a-month Costco (technically BJ's in my case) trip. That's for a family of 4, with only using the trunk (i.e. seats not folded). You can fit a surprising amount of stuff in there.

Either you are buying a ton more than me, or you need to practice your packing skills.

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GJETSON

· #28 · Apr 27, 2020

Packard V8 said:
If the Mini actually has 66% less cargo space than the Bolt, that would be a deal-breaker for us.

p7wang

· #29 · Apr 28, 2020

GetOffYourGas said:
How many people are you feeding? I find the Bolt more than satisfactory for a one-a-month Costco (technically BJ's in my case) trip. That's for a family of 4, with only using the trunk (i.e. seats not folded). You can fit a surprising amount of stuff in there.

Either you are buying a ton more than me, or you need to practice your packing skills.

View attachment 29207

1 Costco pack of TP pretty much takes up the whole trunk.

OrneryZiege

· #30 · Apr 28, 2020

Back in '02 I had to choose between the VW GTI, Acura RSX, and the Mini Cooper. I struck the latter off my list after discovering I would have to take both wheels off my bike to get it in the hatch. If the current Mini is the same then again I would prefer the Bolt as I preferred the GTI (RIP) before.

GetOffYourGas

· #31 · Apr 28, 2020

p7wang said:
1 Costco pack of TP pretty much takes up the whole trunk.

Let's not exaggerate. 1 Costco pack of TP takes up about 1/3 of the floorspace of the trunk, and about 2/3 the height. Far from "pretty much the whole trunk"

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greendave

Discussion Starter · #32 · Apr 28, 2020

Thanks for the link to the video. Yes, storage in the back does look pretty limited. Another reason I would have preferred a 4 door option.

As to why not the i3? Well for me the design is just too off. Mechanicals actually seem pretty good, but I'd like to have a car, not a science project (or a CUV/SUV). My dream would be something like the Bolt/Model 3 drive-train in a GTI/Fit chassis.

Fivedoor

· #33 · Apr 28, 2020

dhazeghi said:
As to why not the i3? Well for me the design is just too off. Mechanicals actually seem pretty good, but I'd like to have a car, not a science project

Exactly my feelings on the i3.

Also, the same reason you couldn't pay me enough to drive the Tesla Cybertruck!

Keith

Packard V8

· #34 · Apr 28, 2020

As to why not the i3? Well for me the design is just too off. Mechanicals actually seem pretty good, but I'd like to have a car, not a science project (or a CUV/SUV). My dream would be something like the Bolt/Model 3 drive-train in a GTI/Fit chassis.

Fivedoor said:
Exactly my feelings on the i3. Also, the same reason you couldn't pay me enough to drive the Tesla Cybertruck! Keith

We have quite the spectrum in this discussion. On the one hand, some here are vociferous the Bolt styling is too boring; BEVs will never be popular until the styling gets more distinctive. Others are equally adamant the i3 and Cybertruck are too weird to ever be accepted. Me? All three of the above I like enough to spend my money to own.

jack vines

Reactions: 1

twriter

· #35 · Apr 28, 2020

As a former MINI user, I'd assert that MINI...er, BWM....really has no clue what to so with a car segment that's DEFINED BY ITS NAME! They keep trying to make MINI models larger and larger and larger, and it's pretty disgusting, if you ask me. The very definition of unclear on the concept.

That said, My biggest disappointment is that MINI/BMW engineers could do better in the range department. As much range as my Bolt has, I still start getting a little anxious when my battery drops below half charged. You'd think as good as BMW engineers claim to be, they could have done better.

But make no mistake: a MINI--especially the MINIs I owned--is FAR more fun to drive than the Bolt. And I enjoy driving my Bolt. But I definitely do miss top-down driving, probably the thing I regret most. Even a sun/moon roof can't compare to a real ragtop. My philosophy was if the sun was up, the top was down. (Actually, the top was down at night too; the only time I drove with it up was when it rained.) And the trunk space in my Coupe and Roadster was probably pretty comparable to the Bolt behind-seat space. Stylistically, though, MINIs and Bolts don't have a lot of overlap in their audience, even with the E version.

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Fivedoor

· #36 · Apr 29, 2020

Packard V8 said:
We have quite the spectrum in this discussion. On the one hand, some here are vociferous the Bolt styling is too boring; BEVs will never be popular until the styling gets more distinctive. Others are equally adamant the i3 and Cybertruck are too weird to ever be accepted. Me? All three of the above I like enough to spend my money to own.

jack vines

Nope:

I am NOT saying that the i3 or Cybertruck will not be accepted, I am saying that I will not purchase them... I know plenty of people that love both of them.

What we need is variety and choice... I want the i3 and Cybertruck lovers to get what they want, and I want something more conventional looking like the Mustang Mach E, or Rivian SUV if I need a large vehicle, or a Bolt or Model 3 in a smaller car.

Keith

PS: I think one of the reasons Tesla is popular is because they have not completely abandoned the Sedan like some manufacturers have done... getting ride of an entire style of car due to a temporary styling trend is short sighted.

OrneryZiege

· #37 · Apr 29, 2020

twriter said:
And the trunk space in my Coupe and Roadster was probably pretty comparable to the Bolt behind-seat space.

The Mini roadster has 8.5 cubic feet of trunk space versus the Bolt's 16.9. I can't find a spec for the roadster with the seats folded down so I'm thinking it wasn't a selling point for the car.

GetOffYourGas

· #38 · Apr 30, 2020

One doesn't buy a car called "mini" for its superb trunk space. I don't understand why this was even brought up!

My biggest disappointment with the car is that the electric will not be available in drop-top form.

greendave

Discussion Starter · #39 · May 1, 2020

twriter said:
As a former MINI user, I'd assert that MINI...er, BWM....really has no clue what to so with a car segment that's DEFINED BY ITS NAME! They keep trying to make MINI models larger and larger and larger, and it's pretty disgusting, if you ask me. The very definition of unclear on the concept.

That said, My biggest disappointment is that MINI/BMW engineers could do better in the range department. As much range as my Bolt has, I still start getting a little anxious when my battery drops below half charged. You'd think as good as BMW engineers claim to be, they could have done better.

But make no mistake: a MINI--especially the MINIs I owned--is FAR more fun to drive than the Bolt. And I enjoy driving my Bolt. But I definitely do miss top-down driving, probably the thing I regret most.

I suspect this isn't really an engineering decision. BMW does have larger batteries, and while they do take more space, the differences are not that dramatic. It's a lot more likely that they were given a target price of $30K and the 42kWh or larger batteries wouldn't meet it.

As to the every-increasing size of the Mini, that's a general problem with vehicles. A current BMW 3-series car is as large as my old 1995 5-series. Expectations regarding space have changed a lot. In general, EVs should help as there's a lot less that needs to go under the hood, but it'll take some time. Also people (or at least Americans) seem to keep getting bigger too...

I would love a hard-top convertible BEV (seen too many bad things happen to soft tops). That's another niche I'm surprised nobody has gone after since the original Roadster. It's not a huge market, but there's definitely a lot less sensitivity to price and you'd have no real competition in it.

Reactions: 1

GJETSON

· #40 · May 2, 2020 (Edited)

The Mini Cooper electric uses the same drivetarin as the BMW i3. So does this bike. For sporty performance, and range comparable to a LR Model 3, this is the one vehicle I would trade our Bolt for.

http://bikeweb.com/files/images/EnglishVsnPeravesCZeMR2018inEnglishScreen%20ShotCROPMar2019.preview.jpg

http://bikeweb.com/files/images/r-racer%20sideview%20small.preview.jpg

It only has half the luggage space of the Mini, but well over twice the range.

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