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Discussion Starter #1
I've never leased a car, but this time probably will, as the EV cars developing at a fast rate. Is this lease, below, on GM.com after configuring a Bolt with everything I can put on it, except floor mats, dealer things, etc...this lease quote seems rich compared to what I've been seeing on ChevyBolt.com , just want to get a fair price....Drove the Bolt Saturday, amazing. $4500 down at closing seems out of line with what others have been saying, would rather not put anything down.

$362
per month for 36 months
Adjust Payments
Ultra-Low-Mileage Lease for Well-Qualified Lessees. $4,540 due at signing (after all offers). No security deposit required. Mileage charge of $0.25 per mile over 30000 miles.
 

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25 cents per mile over? Is that normal? Normally I see 10 cents per mile over.
Maybe 10 cents/mile from 10K miles to 15K miles. Maybe 15 cents/mi. for 15K to 20K miles. Above 30,000 miles, I think 25 cents/mi may be the going rate. And, if OP purchased a 30K mile lease, perhaps $4540 down is the result. A 36 month lease means he may have as much as 90,000 miles on the EV at lease end. Maybe not worth much in the EV market. They want more up front to cover that potential loss.
 

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Maybe 10 cents/mile from 10K miles to 15K miles. Maybe 15 cents/mi. for 15K to 20K miles. Above 30,000 miles, I think 25 cents/mi may be the going rate. And, if OP purchased a 30K mile lease, perhaps $4540 down is the result. A 36 month lease means he may have as much as 90,000 miles on the EV at lease end. Maybe not worth much in the EV market. They want more up front to cover that potential loss.
I've never seen 10 cents/mile for overage. 25 cents is the most common figure, but you do occasionally see 20.
The lease above is for 10K miles/yr (30K total - hence the "Ultra-Low-Mileage Lease")

Very rarely is the lease calculator when configuring a car anywhere near the discounted leases that dealers advertise or that people on the forum are able to negotiate. Those calculators often ignore special lease deals promoted on the very same site.

The lease calculator uses MSRP, and the deals you see on here are heavily discounted. When a dealer has dozens of a model vs the first one or two they get in, they are more likely to come off of MSRP. And keep in mind that in California some dealers are getting some extra incentives (up to $2K?) you are very unlikely to get elsewhere. Each $1000 discounted will lower your payment by over $25.

You need to get an actual quote from the dealer as it will include things like title, registration and tax not included in the online calculator.

And you don't want to put anything "down" on a lease. Do expect to pay your first months payment, and doc, title, registration and acquisition fees are also commonly paid upfront. Just don't make any payment that is applied as a CCR (Capital Cost Reduction).
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thanks for the replies, I don't want to, of course, make a large (for this transaction) down payment/cap cost reduction. I suppose the "national GM lease deal" is negotiable, as everything is. And depends on the state of the transaction with rebates, etc.

Big picture: Are Bolt buyers paying list price or not? On a maxed out Bolt at ~$44k what are they discounting them to?
 

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The way leases work is that the monthly payment is a combination of depreciation and cost of money (interest). The depreciation portion is always calculated from MSRP times the residual percentage divided by the number of months but the interest portion is calculated based on negotiated price less any trade in. There are lease analysis programs available that you can down load to determine how good or bad a given lease is. This complicated formula makes it very difficult for a consumer to know what he is actually paying. One of the ways makers make leases more attractive is by using a higher residual than they know the vehicle will be worth. They gamble that the buyer will keep the vehicle and pay the residual or roll it into a new lease. You should always insist on the lease price with no down payment as all you are doing when you make a down payment is prepaying a portion of the depreciation. The low milage lease is an almost guaranteed way for them to get more at the back end or encourage you to roll into a new lease as most lessors go over that low milage number and they know that. Another thing to look at is the turn in fees. Theses can really add up. It used to be that they allowed for small dents and paint blemishes, scratches, scrapes where your front scrapes over parking stops, etc. Now days they will charge you for these (allowing a few dings smaller than a quarter), tires if worn, along with the disposal fee of $500 or more. You could find yourself owing $1,000 to $3,000 to turn in your vehicle. I always hire one of these dent removers that can match paint and fix minor damage for far less money than the dealer will charge you if you turn it in with the same damage. The average driver puts in 12,000 miles per year. Here in southern California it is probably closer to 15,000 miles. If you go over 6,000 miles times $0.25 per mile you will owe an additional $1,500 at turn in. The price per mile ranges from $0.20 to $0.25 per mile for higher priced vehicles. My Hyundai Genesis is $0.20 per mile and the Mercedes I used to have was $0.25 per mile. I have done many leases over the years so I usually know what I am getting myself into. I never pay a down payment. You up their profit substantially if you do. One last comment. Make sure you want to stay in a lease for the period of the lease as there is no getting out. Even if you wanted out in a year, you will pay for almost the full lease.
 

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Thanks for the replies, I don't want to, of course, make a large (for this transaction) down payment/cap cost reduction. I suppose the "national GM lease deal" is negotiable, as everything is. And depends on the state of the transaction with rebates, etc.

Big picture: Are Bolt buyers paying list price or not? On a maxed out Bolt at ~$44k what are they discounting them to?
In my area (Omaha NE), the Chevy dealers aren't discounting much from sticker price. However, I was able to find a mid-west Chevy dealer in Lansing IL (Phillips Chevrolet) that had a good stock of the Bolts and were willing to make a deal. On a fully loaded Bolt Premier (MSRP $43,510), I could have purchased for $37K with the rebates I qualify for (lease loyalty mainly, I think). I ended up negotiating a 36-month, 10K mile per year lease on this car from Phillips for $395 a month, zero down. They will deliver to my house for $600. I'm happy with the deal and signed the paperwork yesterday -- car should be in my driveway late this week.


Call Shawn Breish at Phillips Chevy at 708-474-0000, ext 465 for a great deal. Shawn was easy to work with and helped me negotiate a great deal. If you do call Shawn, please tell him Rick Nelson referred you.


Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
In my area (Omaha NE), the Chevy dealers aren't discounting much from sticker price. However, I was able to find a mid-west Chevy dealer in Lansing IL (Phillips Chevrolet) that had a good stock of the Bolts and were willing to make a deal. On a fully loaded Bolt Premier (MSRP $43,510), I could have purchased for $37K with the rebates I qualify for (lease loyalty mainly, I think). I ended up negotiating a 36-month, 10K mile per year lease on this car from Phillips for $395 a month, zero down. They will deliver to my house for $600. I'm happy with the deal and signed the paperwork yesterday -- car should be in my driveway late this week.


Call Shawn Breish at Phillips Chevy at 708-474-0000, ext 465 for a great deal. Shawn was easy to work with and helped me negotiate a great deal. If you do call Shawn, please tell him Rick Nelson referred you.


Good luck!

Thanks for the great info, I am starting to think, the discounting or not is market to market, state to state. I'd be pleased with those terms. For most buyers, lease makes more sense, as Bolt 2.0 and other mfg's EVs will be arriving in a flurry in 1-2-3 years from now. Enjoy your Bolt, let us know what you think !
 

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The way leases work is that the monthly payment is a combination of depreciation and cost of money (interest). The depreciation portion is always calculated from MSRP times the residual percentage divided by the number of months but the interest portion is calculated based on negotiated price less any trade in. There are lease analysis programs available that you can down load to determine how good or bad a given lease is. This complicated formula makes it very difficult for a consumer to know what he is actually paying. One of the ways makers make leases more attractive is by using a higher residual than they know the vehicle will be worth. They gamble that the buyer will keep the vehicle and pay the residual or roll it into a new lease. You should always insist on the lease price with no down payment as all you are doing when you make a down payment is prepaying a portion of the depreciation. The low milage lease is an almost guaranteed way for them to get more at the back end or encourage you to roll into a new lease as most lessors go over that low milage number and they know that. Another thing to look at is the turn in fees. Theses can really add up. It used to be that they allowed for small dents and paint blemishes, scratches, scrapes where your front scrapes over parking stops, etc. Now days they will charge you for these (allowing a few dings smaller than a quarter), tires if worn, along with the disposal fee of $500 or more. You could find yourself owing $1,000 to $3,000 to turn in your vehicle. I always hire one of these dent removers that can match paint and fix minor damage for far less money than the dealer will charge you if you turn it in with the same damage. The average driver puts in 12,000 miles per year. Here in southern California it is probably closer to 15,000 miles. If you go over 6,000 miles times $0.25 per mile you will owe an additional $1,500 at turn in. The price per mile ranges from $0.20 to $0.25 per mile for higher priced vehicles. My Hyundai Genesis is $0.20 per mile and the Mercedes I used to have was $0.25 per mile. I have done many leases over the years so I usually know what I am getting myself into. I never pay a down payment. You up their profit substantially if you do. One last comment. Make sure you want to stay in a lease for the period of the lease as there is no getting out. Even if you wanted out in a year, you will pay for almost the full lease.


Barjohn: I agree with most of what you explained, but I do want to point out that you can occasionally get out of a lease early with no penalty (or actual profit) by simply buying the car for the current payoff amount and either selling it or trading it in. Leased cars have a monthly Payoff amount, just like financed cars, and I've had several instances where I negotiated such a great deal on the lease that the car actually had equity after just 1 year of ownership. I really don't know if this philosophy would apply to a Bolt lease, since the leasing company has artificially inflated the Residual so much, but for anyone contemplating trying to get out of a lease early, it's worth looking at the Payoff/trade-in option in addition to simply paying all the remaining lease payments.
 

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riknchar: What you say may be true for a select few vehicles but has to be a rarity. The penalty plus the residual in most leases results in a payoff far above the current wholesale value, which is the most one can rely on receiving in a sale. Trade-ins are a whole different game because the dealers can play with the numbers between the trade-in value and the car they are selling. Most manufacturer's leasing companies are offering to waive fees, over mileage and remaining lease payments and penalties during the last 90 days of the lease or sometimes even longer periods if you trade it in on a new leased vehicle from the same manufacturer. For example, my Hyundai Genesis lease with Hyundai finance is making me that offer on a new Genesis with 10 months left on the lease. However, since I plan to purchase a new Tesla Model 3, it doesn't help me. The current Kelly Blue Book is considerably lower than my residual meaning the percentage of MSRP used to calculate the residual was far better than reality and that the manufacturer offered that percentage knowing the car would not be worth it at lease end but allowing them to sell a lower lease payment because the depreciation component of the lease was smaller.
 

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riknchar: What you say may be true for a select few vehicles but has to be a rarity. The penalty plus the residual in most leases results in a payoff far above the current wholesale value, which is the most one can rely on receiving in a sale. Trade-ins are a whole different game because the dealers can play with the numbers between the trade-in value and the car they are selling. Most manufacturer's leasing companies are offering to waive fees, over mileage and remaining lease payments and penalties during the last 90 days of the lease or sometimes even longer periods if you trade it in on a new leased vehicle from the same manufacturer. For example, my Hyundai Genesis lease with Hyundai finance is making me that offer on a new Genesis with 10 months left on the lease. However, since I plan to purchase a new Tesla Model 3, it doesn't help me. The current Kelly Blue Book is considerably lower than my residual meaning the percentage of MSRP used to calculate the residual was far better than reality and that the manufacturer offered that percentage knowing the car would not be worth it at lease end but allowing them to sell a lower lease payment because the depreciation component of the lease was smaller.
It is a bit unusual, but I know for a fact it's happened to me on at least 3 occasions. And I'm very familiar with how dealers can manipulate the overall deal to make it appear they are giving me a lot for my trade in. I've bought or leased over 50 new cars in my life (I am a 'car-aholic' and have 5 kids, so I'm constantly leasing cars).


I leased a Toyota Prius for a great deal (and zero down, of course) when they were relatively new, and gas prices soared after I leased, driving the value of the car way up. I traded out of it a year later and pocketed roughly $1600 in profit. I leased a Honda Accord a while back and found that it was worth more than the payoff after a year, so I swapped to a newer Accord for an even lower price. My parents had leased a Subaru Legacy 3 years ago, and had really babied the car all 3 years (that's just the way they are with cars). The car only had 16K miles after 3 years, and they were on their way to the dealership to return the car when I convinced them that it was probably worth more than the payoff. We swung into a couple of dealerships and ended up selling it to a dealership for $1400 more than the payoff. My parents avoided the $400 lease turn-in fee and pocketed an unexpected $1400.


So, while definitely not common, it's worth looking into
 

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FWIW, Camp Chevrolet (and the GM website at the time of purchase) had no lease deals I'd consider signing. They were insistent on the $4500 down and nearly $400 a month. With all the fine print for in and out amortized over the 36-months, the end cost would have been nearly $600 a month.

And no, they weren't discounting at all; we paid within $1,000 of the MSRP. Buying the Bolt didn't make any financial sense at all, but we just wanted the Bolt. (And yes, we still love it!)

Doing it looking at EV-value-per-dollar, I'd have bought a 2014 i3 lease return for $18,000 - $20,000.

jack vines
 

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I just checked on my Genesis and they wanted the remaining monthly payments, the $400 disposal fee, the excess milage and the residual. KBB trade in value for a fully loaded vehicle in very good condition with 41,000 miles: $22,025, sell to a private party: $25,418. Payments remaining: $4,671, excess mileage: $1,000, disposal fee $400, residual value: $29,142 so a buyout would cost me: $35,213 for a loss of $13,180 or I could just turn it in for a cost of $6,071. Of course they will waive all of that if I roll it into a new lease for a new Genesis. Once I get the new Tesla, I will just pay off the lease and let it sit at my house until lease expiration since they won't give me anything for turning it in early, no reason to help them get a better profit.

By the way, it has been a great car but living in CA it just makes sense to go all electric as gas and other costs keep rising. Using the car pool lanes and free or reduced tolls is also a factor.
 

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Using the car pool lanes and free or reduced tolls is also a factor.
A self-limiting benefit if we increase the number (and the percentage) of EVs on the road. Also mostly a benefit on the coasts where population density is high. I doubt that driving the "HOV lanes" is considered a benefit in Montana. In fact, (although they MAY exist) I know of no such lanes in the entire state of WV. AND, many states that rely heavily on gasoline taxes are charging EV owners more to register their vehicle to compensate.
 

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A self-limiting benefit if we increase the number (and the percentage) of EVs on the road. Also mostly a benefit on the coasts where population density is high. I doubt that driving the "HOV lanes" is considered a benefit in Montana. In fact, (although they MAY exist) I know of no such lanes in the entire state of WV. AND, many states that rely heavily on gasoline taxes are charging EV owners more to register their vehicle to compensate.
Nebraska is one of those "backward" states in terms of EV encouragement. I have to pay an ADDITIONAL $75 to register my car each year, since I'm sneaking around paying the road taxes embedded in gasoline prices. Oh well, it's still worth it, but I do get a kick out of reading all the perks EV owners get in more "progressive" states.
 

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A self-limiting benefit if we increase the number (and the percentage) of EVs on the road. Also mostly a benefit on the coasts where population density is high. I doubt that driving the "HOV lanes" is considered a benefit in Montana. In fact, (although they MAY exist) I know of no such lanes in the entire state of WV. AND, many states that rely heavily on gasoline taxes are charging EV owners more to register their vehicle to compensate.
Believe it or not, CA's goals for EV vehicles is no where close to being achieved and some say may not be achievable for many years into the future. The number of EVs in CA compared to ICE vehicles is tiny. They had sold nearly 300,000 EVs & PEVs in CA by 5/17. The goal is to reach 1.5M by 2025. As of 12/16 there were 34.721M vehicles registered in CA. In other words, EVs only account of 0.86% of vehicles on the road in CA. It will be some time before EVs reach a significant percentage to have a self limiting effect. Even if CA reached the 1.5M goal it would only be 4.32% assuming the total number remained constant (which it won't). Further, most recent analysis says CA is not likely to be able to reach that goal.
 

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Thanks for the heads up!

In my area (Omaha NE), the Chevy dealers aren't discounting much from sticker price. However, I was able to find a mid-west Chevy dealer in Lansing IL (Phillips Chevrolet) that had a good stock of the Bolts and were willing to make a deal. On a fully loaded Bolt Premier (MSRP $43,510), I could have purchased for $37K with the rebates I qualify for (lease loyalty mainly, I think). I ended up negotiating a 36-month, 10K mile per year lease on this car from Phillips for $395 a month, zero down. They will deliver to my house for $600. I'm happy with the deal and signed the paperwork yesterday -- car should be in my driveway late this week.


Call Shawn Breish at Phillips Chevy at 708-474-0000, ext 465 for a great deal. Shawn was easy to work with and helped me negotiate a great deal. If you do call Shawn, please tell him Rick Nelson referred you.


Good luck!
I live in Lexington, Kentucky and every Bolt here is still at MSRP. I looked up this Illinois dealership and they have Bolts for $4500 off MSRP. I called them up and they verified I could purchase one for that discount price! I'm trying to confirm that my College Discount and Lease Loyalty (wife leases a 2017 Volt) will also combine on top of this. Either way, I think a trip to Illinois is in my near future! Flights to O'Hare are only $81 from here :D

Thank you so much for enlightening me to this dealership!

Edit: Just got my quote from them. They aren't giving me the GM College Discount, but they are giving me the GM Lease Loyalty valued at $1500. Found a $132 flight from Louisville (a little closer than the cheaper Cincinnati airport). I am so excited!
 

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helpwith leaseinarizona

sorry to mess up your tread but I would like to know what lease people have received in arizona.

don't need infor about lease vs buying but i would like to have an example of a lease from arizona, don't need dealers name but i would like one from arizona

thanks
 

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sorry to mess up your tread but I would like to know what lease people have received in arizona.

don't need infor about lease vs buying but i would like to have an example of a lease from arizona, don't need dealers name but i would like one from arizona does this post a 2nd time?
 
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