[Dr.G]

Has anyone heard of this before? How could the system know when the utilities are turning to more polluting sources for power generation at a given time?

http://insideevs.com/emotorwerks-new-juicenet-program-can-save-california-ev-drivers-400year/

eMotorWerks JuiceNet program is a charging solution that co-ordinates with regional power companies’ grid management systems to notify your charger when the system is under strain or “dirty” power is in use.

When a JuiceNet enabled charging system is running, either via EMW’s own JuiceBox Pro charger (10 kW), or using your existing EVSE with a JuicePlug universal attachment (retailing at $149), the charge rate is modulated/lowered temporarily until the grid load is stabilized.

The program is currently available in California only

 

[DucRider]

The power company themselves sends the signals.

This a a "baby step" V2G implementation that we will see increase over time. California used to have brown outs during hot summer days, but with the high rate of solar adoption, they now have over capacity during daylight hours (and they would actually like you to charge your car then). The peak time comes after work when people get home, turn on the lights, fire up the oven or stove, crank the A/C, etc. Power grids have to be designed to meet this peak load, so that is when the natural gas, coal plants, etc really need to be cranking. The problem is that these are not easy to fire-up "on demand". Using batteries to store the over capacity produced by solar (and to some extent by wind) during the day for later use allows a grid with lower overall power generating capabilities.

This buffering by batteries will be the primary use for "worn out" EV batteries that still have 70% of their original capacity. Not good for driving your EV, but perfectly adequate for grid buffering.

V2G (Vehicle to Grid) technology allows EV's to be used to buffer the system and be part of a bigger battery storage system on the grid itself. It allows the utility to "borrow" electricity from an EV that is plugged in and connected. This is done at a low rate, so doesn't stress the battery and reduce battery life. Heat is the primary cause of battery degradation, and slow charge/discharge produces little to no heat. The EV is then "paid back" the electricity when grid demand is reduced. You will likely get "paid" a small amount to allow the utility to do this.

For more info and graphics, google "Duck Curve".

 

[Dr.G]

The power company themselves sends the signals.

This a a "baby step" V2G implementation that we will see increase over time. California used to have brown outs during hot summer days, but with the high rate of solar adoption, they now have over capacity during daylight hours (and they would actually like you to charge your car then). The peak time comes after work when people get home, turn on the lights, fire up the oven or stove, crank the A/C, etc. Power grids have to be designed to meet this peak load, so that is when the natural gas, coal plants, etc really need to be cranking. The problem is that these are not easy to fire-up "on demand". Using batteries to store the over capacity produced by solar (and to some extent by wind) during the day for later use allows a grid with lower overall power generating capabilities.

This buffering by batteries will be the primary use for "worn out" EV batteries that still have 70% of their original capacity. Not good for driving your EV, but perfectly adequate for grid buffering.

V2G (Vehicle to Grid) technology allows EV's to be used to buffer the system and be part of a bigger battery storage system on the grid itself. It allows the utility to "borrow" electricity from an EV that is plugged in and connected. This is done at a low rate, so doesn't stress the battery and reduce battery life. Heat is the primary cause of battery degradation, and slow charge/discharge produces little to no heat. The EV is then "paid back" the electricity when grid demand is reduced. You will likely get "paid" a small amount to allow the utility to do this.

For more info and graphics, google "Duck Curve".

Thank you for the explanation! I'm still learning so much about EVs after a lifetime of ICE vehicles.

 

[LightningBolt]

If you're not using their equipment already you'll need to get a JuicePlug universal attachment for $149 and you may not be earning much from it, they say you can earn up to $400/year. May as well just charger your car at night when everyone is asleep.

 

[lbg3093]

As a retired utility engineer one of the 1st things I realized about owning an electric vehicle was that “when you charge your car” is crucial to wether you are actually lowering CO2! If the marginal power you are using is coal, as would often be the case in the Midwest, you might as well drive gasoline engine. It is a lot more complicated than just charging when system load is down at night.

JuiceNet in theory, solves this problem by only charging when clean power is available like natural gas or wind. Frankly, I’m a little sckeptical but I’m giving it a test right now. I would like to know if others think this green charger really accomplishes it’s goal of only using green power to charge a car?

In theory JuiceNet Smart charger solves this issue

 

[martinknutson]

The power company themselves sends the signals.

This a a "baby step" V2G implementation that we will see increase over time. California used to have brown outs during hot summer days, but with the high rate of solar adoption, they now have over capacity during daylight hours (and they would actually like you to charge your car then). The peak time comes after work when people get home, turn on the lights, fire up the oven or stove, crank the A/C, etc. Power grids have to be designed to meet this peak load, so that is when the natural gas, coal plants, etc really need to be cranking. The problem is that these are not easy to fire-up "on demand". Using batteries to store the over capacity produced by solar (and to some extent by wind) during the day for later use allows a grid with lower overall power generating capabilities.

This buffering by batteries will be the primary use for "worn out" EV batteries that still have 70% of their original capacity. Not good for driving your EV, but perfectly adequate for grid buffering.

V2G (Vehicle to Grid) technology allows EV's to be used to buffer the system and be part of a bigger battery storage system on the grid itself. It allows the utility to "borrow" electricity from an EV that is plugged in and connected. This is done at a low rate, so doesn't stress the battery and reduce battery life. Heat is the primary cause of battery degradation, and slow charge/discharge produces little to no heat. The EV is then "paid back" the electricity when grid demand is reduced. You will likely get "paid" a small amount to allow the utility to do this.

For more info and graphics, google "Duck Curve".

It's a small nit, but the brownouts ended because Enron (and a few others) stopped gaming the power market, long before rooftop solar and large solar farms made a dent in power generation in California


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis


That being said, the crisis did encourage the state to develop pricing plans where, for a reduced wholesale rate, some large consumers signed up to be throttled during times of peak demand. This is an evolution of that concept.