It's just very difficult to make hydrogen and store it and use it in a car whereas electric cars just needs to be plugged in. There's a place for hydrogen fuel like maybe semi trucks, airlines, etc but it's just no viable for the average buyer like us to track down a fueling station and o through a three step process just for some fuel. And you know...explosive hydrogen is always a fear of mine.
honda Clarity Fuel Cell Launched in Japan with 466 Mile Range
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Aerodynamics
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This thread is about the Clarity, not the Bolt
So far I haven't heard anything here that would make hydrogen fuel cell vehicles a "no go".
Lack of fueling stations - that can be fixed by putting some in. In fact, I see far more hydrogen fueling stations in the Los Angeles area than CSS DCFC.
Dependent on a few suppliers - I see a lot of different suppliers on this map. Who's your supplier at your house? A government controlled monopoly. Even with solar panels, the government can cut back on net metering or institute solar panel taxes.
Hydrogen Stations Map
Dangerous - gasoline is not that safe, and it works. Based on this video, Lithium batteries aren't all that safe either.
Tesla Fireworks Show
Hydrogen fuels in few minutes, and it has about twice the range. Which would you rather take on a cross country trip (assuming stations are present)?
I think it is far too early in the game to declare one technology better than the other. We'll see a lot of changes in both in the next 10 years.
Michael
Lack of fueling stations - that can be fixed by putting some in. In fact, I see far more hydrogen fueling stations in the Los Angeles area than CSS DCFC.
Dependent on a few suppliers - I see a lot of different suppliers on this map. Who's your supplier at your house? A government controlled monopoly. Even with solar panels, the government can cut back on net metering or institute solar panel taxes.
Hydrogen Stations Map
Dangerous - gasoline is not that safe, and it works. Based on this video, Lithium batteries aren't all that safe either.
Tesla Fireworks Show
Hydrogen fuels in few minutes, and it has about twice the range. Which would you rather take on a cross country trip (assuming stations are present)?
I think it is far too early in the game to declare one technology better than the other. We'll see a lot of changes in both in the next 10 years.
Michael
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First, I think it needs to be made clear that hydrogen isn't a source of energy, like fossil fuels, wind, or sunshine. It is strictly a storage medium, because there is no free hydrogen on Earth - it floats off into space when released, and reacts with oxygen in the presence of a spark. So hydrogen is used to store energy from either fossil fuel (natural gas), or from electricity at the hydrogen station. The problem with having oil companies control hydrogen fueling stations is that they usually want to produce it from natural gas, not from renewable energy. They also want to make as much profit from it as possible, and to restrict others from producing it when possible. Aside from that, no problem! ;-)
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No, I just somewhat described large for-profit electric utility companies. Even those are publicly regulated much more than oil companies.
For-profit, public, doesn't matter. Monopolies screw people over. Every increase is rubber stamped. I've been to the public hearings. They are dog and pony shows, with a vote at the end to increase prices just like they wanted.
At least with gasoline, there is some competition, and it even goes down in price sometimes. Imagine that!
Did you know that governments and utilities are so power hungry that's they have made it illegal to go off the grid in many areas of the country?
Michael
At least with gasoline, there is some competition, and it even goes down in price sometimes. Imagine that!
Did you know that governments and utilities are so power hungry that's they have made it illegal to go off the grid in many areas of the country?
Michael
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I'm afraid I don't agree with using utility monopolies to argue for expanding the power of fossil fuel companies.
My thoughts
A couple issues with your facts here. The NASA boosters were were solid fuel, not hydrogen. Hydrogen is a very light gas, so it rises quickly and dissipates. It's unlikely you could get high concentrations of depressurized gas in the passenger compartment. I would worry more about fossil fuels impact on the planet. Hydrogen can be made with renewables and water. Personally, I plan to go solar to battery, it's simpler.Hydrogen is a dangerous fuel. Ask the professionals who supply it to NASA for their space boosters!
Hydrogen is colorless, odorless, and as invisible as oxygen. SInce the H2 tank is pressurized, if it escapes, it absorbs heat quickly to expand. If a customer is unfortunate to breath it at that moment, the cold gas will freeze the mouth, toungue, throat, and bronchal path, killing by asphixiation. Gasoline and natural gas are both toxic but the customer can detect it sooner before the vapors do harm. Not so with cold hydrogen gas!
currently hydrogen fuel is produced from fossil fuel, at least we're moving towards renewable electricity sources that isn't reliant on fossil fuels. But the main point for me is how accessible each source of power is. I can easily plug in an electric car, but the same can't be said for hydrogen fuel.
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3 minute refueling is hugely optimistic and the lack of fueling stations makes long distance travel just a theoretical possibility.
Hydrogen flow chart:
Use electricity to split hydrogen out of natural gas
Use electricity to compress to ~5000 psi
Use electricity to cool the compressed hydrogen
Transport by tanker to fueling station
Use electricity to compress hydrogen to 10,000 psi for fueling vehicles
Use electricity to cool the compressed hydrogen
Use a fuel cell to convert hydrogen back to electricity to power EV
Not the model of efficiency.
Big Oil likes this model as it allows them to continue "business as usual". You pull your vehicle into their station, put a nozzle in your car and give them money. The still get to drill and extract fossil fuels, hydrogen is used to store and transport energy.
The public doesn't care about efficiency. If they did, they wouldn't be replacing their sedans with SUVs and pickup trucks, which now represent over 50% of all passenger vehicles sold. If they did, they would have been buying diesels all these years.
Given your hatred of "big oil" and fossil fuels, you have solar panels which exceed your electric vehicle's charging rate and you are only charging your car during mid-day when the sun is shining, right?
Given your hatred of "big oil" and fossil fuels, you have solar panels which exceed your electric vehicle's charging rate and you are only charging your car during mid-day when the sun is shining, right?
There are plenty of YouTube videos of Mirai's being fueled in five minutes. A Honda Clarity could go from LA to San Jose to Sacramento to Lake Tahoe with one five minute fueling stop using existing stations today. That's not long distance travel?
I don't buy into the "one powertrain fits all" mentality. We have more choices than ever, and some work better than others for particular applications and buyers.
Electricity prices go down, too, in deregulated markets. My kWh price dropped 1.5¢ on my latest contract.
Official: Honda Discontinues Clarity PHEV And Clarity Fuel Cell
Honda has officially confirmed to InsideEVs' sister site Motor1 that it will conclude production of the Clarity Plug-in Hybrid and Clarity Fuel Cell in August.
insideevs.com
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