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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Local Hyundai dealer selling new Ionic 5 advertised with no markup, in stock one presumes... This is the same dealer (LJ Chevy) that offered me opportunity to order a Bolt for 2k ADM a few weeks back.

I I am guessing without any rebate, the Ioniq5s are moving a bit slower than before, especially if one can have a Ford, Tesla, VW, for 7500 off...? A nearby dealer offered me an Ioniq5 in the fall for just 5k ADM...

All interesting, given what's happened in the last year...

 

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Lee Johnson is terrible with the ADM. I find that kind of "we'll squeeze them til they scream" attitude at the time of sale tends to correlate to after-sale service too. I bought my EUV from Gilchrist in Port Orchard last week for MSRP (plus their bogus $200 paint treatment) and it was fast and easy.
 

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There's a dealership in central NJ (Fred Beans, Flemington) that's selling Ioniq 5s at MSRP, but we had to wait about 6 months for ours. They did say that some people on the list were from the west coast and would be driving their cars back once they arrived.
 

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Even at MSRP my problem with the Ioniq 5 is that it's not worth the almost $60k it gets to when you get to the top spec. It's my problem with all of these cars in this tier to be honest, even the "cheap" ID.4 gets to over $55k when you get to the top-trim. This for a car the size and quality of a VW Golf. Really? I love me Golfs, owned several (many if you count Jettas and GTIs) but they're not $55k+ value in any trim combinations or even BEV drivetrain.

As someone who aims to own their cars for 10 years, I don't mind reaching for what the car was "meant to be" as in the long run the few thousand doesn't amount to much if you're not constantly needing to be in a new car. The way these EVs are priced changes that math. You come in with a starting MSRP in your head around $40k and then see $60k, out of reach of most subsidies, it just changes the math, completely and entirely.

Yet these things are sold out continually. The fact that there's never a reckoning for these obviously stupid at face value financial decisions is proof our entire financial system is fucked. If this many people can waste this much money this consistently without the thing coming crashing down that means the system is rife with slaves whether those slaves know they're slaves or not. Capitalism, **** ya.
 

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I just paid about 55k for a Hyundai Ioniq 5 SEL AWD and I think it is worth every penny. The Bolt at 40k was a bargain. We happen300ked to need 2 new cars after driving Priuses for 18 years and 300k miles. Yes, these are high prices but a lot of people will pay much more for a Mercedes, Lexus, BMW, Tesla, etc. The Bolt is perfect as an affordable EV.
 

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This for a car the size and quality of a VW Golf.
I won't argue about the quality, but the ID.4 is larger than a Golf, at least inside. There's a GTI in my garage right now, and I can assure you there's far more space in the ID.4. I haven't driven the AWD version, but chances are it's as quick as the GTI as well.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Even at MSRP my problem with the Ioniq 5 is that it's not worth the almost $60k it gets to when you get to the top spec. It's my problem with all of these cars in this tier to be honest, even the "cheap" ID.4 gets to over $55k when you get to the top-trim. This for a car the size and quality of a VW Golf. Really? I love me Golfs, owned several (many if you count Jettas and GTIs) but they're not $55k+ value in any trim combinations or even BEV drivetrain.

As someone who aims to own their cars for 10 years, I don't mind reaching for what the car was "meant to be" as in the long run the few thousand doesn't amount to much if you're not constantly needing to be in a new car. The way these EVs are priced changes that math. You come in with a starting MSRP in your head around $40k and then see $60k, out of reach of most subsidies, it just changes the math, completely and entirely.

Yet these things are sold out continually. The fact that there's never a reckoning for these obviously stupid at face value financial decisions is proof our entire financial system is fucked. If this many people can waste this much money this consistently without the thing coming crashing down that means the system is rife with slaves whether those slaves know they're slaves or not. Capitalism, **** ya.
[IMO] All of these prices are aimed at mid-high end car buyer segment, which is what the Tesla has too. Its fine, but I think it should be recognized that at these price points (>50k), these cars are replacing BMWs, Audis, Mercedes, etc. That's fine, but represents only a small portion of the car buying segment. The Bolt is exactly what the EV market needs, especially the lower end EV. The fast charging is a weak point - irrelevant IMO for most who have driveways, but for a lot of people who cannot charge at home easily (Apt/Condo/etc), an inexpensive faster charging EV would be very desirable - once there is proper infrastructure anyway.

I had a nicely equipped ID.4 on order - produced actually - then I came to my senses. At 53k, it was pretty pricey and completely unnecessary as a third car (or second honestly, practically speaking). If I was replacing a family car, it might have made sense (from a price only perspective). But there is really no EV out there (that I am aware of) capable of hauling 5 people, a dog, and gear for skiing, camping, biking, or whatever, 400 miles one way. For me, I was looking at a car that could absorb some gas usage out of the ICE vehicles we have, and thus spending an extra 15-25k on an EV to save 2-3k per year (if I'm lucky) made no sense to me. But if I wanted a lux vehicle for me only, I might have jumped into something nicer, probably will in a few years. But honestly most of the ones out there now: Hyundai, Kia, ID.4, even the Teslas, don't appeal to me at all design-wise.
 

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The way these EVs are priced changes that math. You come in with a starting MSRP in your head around $40k and then see $60k, out of reach of most subsidies, it just changes the math, completely and entirely.

Yet these things are sold out continually. The fact that there's never a reckoning for these obviously stupid at face value financial decisions is proof our entire financial system is fucked. If this many people can waste this much money this consistently without the thing coming crashing down that means the system is rife with slaves whether those slaves know they're slaves or not. Capitalism, **** ya.
Any [NA assembled*] EV that can be classified as an SUV gets the $7500 subsidy up to $80k. For example, that now includes the Lyriq and ID.4, under the latest ruling.

No doubt some people are spending too much of their budget on cars, but $60k EVs are still a small fraction of all new vehicles sold. And many are just buying used cars.

And, a $60k Ioniq 5 to someone making $120k/year post tax, is 6 months of work. That's exactly the same amount of labor as a $30k Bolt is to someone making $60k/year post tax. So, the Ioniq 5 buyer may be no more (or no less) a "slave" than the Bolt buyer.

* Clarification thanks to @atc98092
 
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Any North American assembled EV.
Thank you for the clarification. I was careful to only give the Lyriq and ID.4 as an example, but good catch on your part. I edited my post, but credited you for it.
 

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Yeah, it's just a detail that needs to clear when discussing the federal tax credit. They have made it so convoluted to determine what/who qualifies for the credit. I wish they would have given the manufacturers a window of eligibility to allow time to transition to NA assembly, but it is what it is.
 
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I highly considered an EV6 and was a month or so away from delivery (after waiting 8months). I would have qualified for the tax rebate but it wasn't 100% clear given what qualified as a deposit. Anyway, both Ioniq5 and EV6 are stellar vehicles. But, the BoltEUV is a better value for what it is. I think if someone is in the need to DCFC routinely (like daily) then the difference in price between a Bolt or Ioniq5 is probably worth it for the time saved. The Bolt's weakness is the Ioniq5's strength. Most people charge at home/work and road tripping is not a daily thing.
 

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I bought a Bolt. My wife got the Ioniq 5. I've been upstaged!
That's nothing! I drive a 12 year old shifter car Cruze. My wife has a loaded EUV. She lets me borrow it occasionally though. :D
 

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Clearly this calls for a Bolt EV to be in the driveway too. Probably come close to breaking even on the running costs on the Cruze :D
I've been extremely lucky with the 2011 Cruze Eco. Out of warranty repairs so far, are under $500 total. The brakes, exhaust, and clutch are original. It doesn't hurt that I'm handy with a wrench though, as I've been able to cheaply fix a few things myself. And I do my own oil changes.

And my mpg is about 35 in mostly city driving. Cheap insurance too, just basic coverage. Hard to justify replacing it with an EV since, being retired, I now only drive it about 2k miles/year. The EUV is the "family" car, but my wife gets first dibs.

Actually, I'll likely never replace the Cruze. If it starts to nickel and dime me to death, I'll just get rid of it and we'll manage on one car. I can rent Bolts by the hour just two blocks away, plus we have good transit close by.
 

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Get your Eco rims if you do junk it.
I removed them from the car in the fall, and am now using the OE wheels from our late Volt on the Eco. The Volt was totaled with the snow tires/wheels on. At some point, the Eco rims will find their way on our EUV.

You are right, these forged aluminum wheels need to roll on after the Eco is gone. They've only been through one winter, and are in good shape.
Tire Wheel Automotive tire Vehicle Motor vehicle
 
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