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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Gotta finally comment here, in an attempt to reduce the chance that a rookie EV-and-DCFC user will resort to using the emergency stop button on the DCFC. With a DCFC session in progress (not already ended due to being at 100%), a strong and long push on the big plug's button should, as I understand, cause the EV to command the DCFC to bring the charger's DC current down to zero. Once that is done the Bolt will open the little shiny tab that is locking the big plug onto the Bolt's receptacle. The other ways of stopping the DCFC session and bringing the DC current to zero as already described above are also fine, of course.

In my experience this strong and long push on the plug's button might take 3 seconds, and if there is not too much ambient noise it might be possible to then hear the DCFC winding down (cooling fan?). That would confirm the DC current is down at zero and so now a pull would work to safely remove the plug. Could also bend down and look for that shiny tab to be in the up position to confirm that the lock is not in effect any more. The Bolt's design with this shiny locking tab is meant to hold the big plug in place and so prevent the user from interrupting a high DC current (an arc) by somehow forcing the plug off when the current is still above zero.
Yes, emergency stop shouldn't normally be used.

As for strong and long push, FWIW on the BTC Fatboy charger in the movie in post #3, I was surprised by the very fast, almost immediate release upon a quick and not strong press at all. It was almost identical in feel to just use J1772 AC handles (except those don't cause Bolt's silver locking tab to engage or disengage).
 

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Yes, emergency stop shouldn't normally be used.

As for strong and long push, FWIW on the BTC Fatboy charger in the movie in post #3, I was surprised by the very fast, almost immediate release upon a quick and not strong press at all. It was almost identical in feel to just use J1772 AC handles (except those don't cause Bolt's silver locking tab to engage or disengage).
I learned about the long push for a DCFC situation only after having a problem releasing a DCFC plug on my first road trip. My usual short button push like on a J1772 plug, and then pull, did not work for this rookie. Should have known better. In a L1 or L2 session the Bolt allows the J1772 to be pulled off very quickly (maybe the shiny tab is not even in a locked position for a J1772 session - have never really checked) - because interrupting 32 A of AC current is not a big deal. On the DCFC the DC current needs to be respected - by getting it down to zero A.

If some DCFC units take the DC current down to zero very fast, that could be why some DCFC users have experienced a quicker plug release - perhaps a faster DCFC control circuit than I have experienced, or the DC current was already closer to zero.
 

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IIRC, one can just push the stereo's power button/knob and navigate to the screen with it (via energy button?) then press stop.

As for "tapping the button on the charger connector", on at least 1 of them, you can't as I said. You're mechanically blocked and can't seem to. As I wrote earlier:
"IIRC, the ChargePoint CPE 250 units at ChargePoint HQ in Campbell CA and maybe the CPE100 there too were the cases where it didn't work and you could feel flexing and maybe even the microswitch in the handle being triggered but charging didn't stop."
Right - I'm not disagreeing that they exist. Just that I've yet to encounter one.

Their CCS CPE 100 was broken yesterday. Wouldn't start charging. Hit an internal fault error. I took off. I just wanted to see if it was free since it was off network.

I wasn't going to bother w/the other 25 cent per kWh DC FCs there since I was going to use some free L2's or I could use 19 cent/kWh DC FCs elsewhere.
That's a bargain! As I noted elsewhere, most of the travel corridor ChargePoint units start at $0.40/kWh. EvGo starts at $0.34/kWh (if you're early/late). EA is $0.31/kWh with membership. Gas isn't the only fuel price that's gone up...
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
As for strong and long push, FWIW on the BTC Fatboy charger in the movie in post #3, I was surprised by the very fast, almost immediate release upon a quick and not strong press at all. It was almost identical in feel to just use J1772 AC handles (except those don't cause Bolt's silver locking tab to engage or disengage).
Ok, when coming back from a trip to So Cal, I used a Caltrans BTC Fatboy in Delano, CA at PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You. On one of the chargers, the screen didn't work. The LCD was clearly on (had a grey screen and backlight illuminating it) but it was blank. For kicks, I plugged in and it did start charging. But, I didn't know where to press on the blank touchscreen to stop. The hardware stop button didn't work.

Here was another one where pressing even very hard on the CCS1 handle's button did NOT stop the charger at all. I couldn't even get it to the point where I could hear the microswitch in the handle clicking. It didn't seem like this was on of those two stage buttons at all. I ended up having to press stop on the infotainment system. If that failed, I'd have resorted to emergency stop.

I then switched to the other charger (same model) at the site so that I could least see the screen and its stats.
 
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Yes, emergency stop shouldn't normally be used.

As for strong and long push, FWIW on the BTC Fatboy charger in the movie in post #3, I was surprised by the very fast, almost immediate release upon a quick and not strong press at all. It was almost identical in feel to just use J1772 AC handles (except those don't cause Bolt's silver locking tab to engage or disengage).
What is the Emergency Stop Button ? Why shouldn't you use it?
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·

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What is the Emergency Stop Button ? Why shouldn't you use it?
Many DC Fast Chargers or their associated transformer lockers have an emergency stop button that's kind of like the emergency stop button on an escalator - it's there to kill the power if there's an emergency. It's hard for me to imagine an actual emergency that might require its use because of all the other safeguards built into the CCS charging standard, but if you see someone holding the charge cord handle and they're shaking violently then I suppose it would be the logical go-to.

The reason you shouldn't use it under non-emergency conditions is that tripping it will often lock out the power until a service technical comes to reset it. That makes the charger unavailable to everyone else.

My DCFC shutdown protocol is to press the charge cord handle button first 'cause that's the easiest thing to do. If that doesn't work, go to the controls on the charger (typically a touch screen button) and do it there. If that doesn't work, then the least convenient is to go into the car's infotainment system menus and cancel it there. I don't think I've ever had to resort to the latter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
The reason you shouldn't use it under non-emergency conditions is that tripping it will often lock out the power until a service technical comes to reset it. That makes the charger unavailable to everyone else.
I've never personally encountered one like that but I have heard something like that before.

On that note, years back (well before I had a Bolt), I remember some place (dealer?) claiming that pressing emergency stop costs hundreds or thousands of dollars to fix, which sounds like total BS. It would be a serious design flaw for a DC FC to sustain significant damage every single time it was pressed.

I've sometimes pressed the emergency stop on DC FCs that are malfunctioning to reboot them. In some cases, it has helped.
My DCFC shutdown protocol is to press the charge cord handle button first 'cause that's the easiest thing to do. If that doesn't work, go to the controls on the charger (typically a touch screen button) and do it there. If that doesn't work, then the least convenient is to go into the car's infotainment system menus and cancel it there. I don't think I've ever had to resort to the latter.
For CCS DC FCing, I would never press the button on the handle first since as I said, I've found numerous ones where it doesn't work or in one case, it required so much force and resulting clunky (for lack of better words), it didn't seem like an action they intended for people do to much.

1st place for me is always stopping from the DC FC side. Unfortunately, some units like the ChargePoint CPE 250's I've encountered have touchscreen calibration problems. So, it can take many tries to get the stop to work. On some, like CPE 100, you need to swipe the same card you used to start it. I have 3 CP cards on the same account but only the one that started it will work to stop. So, on those, I might press stop on the infotainment system first.

Also, in some cases, the station owner may have disabled the stop button on the app. This is the case of the two cheap 19 cent/kWh CPE 250 chargers near home. You get a dialog along the lines of the station owner has disabled the stop functionality for some goofy community reason. Thanks a lot. I'm trying to stop my own session, not someone else's!

For J1772 L1 and L2 charging of Bolt, of course, I just push on the handle's trigger. That works every time.
 

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For CCS DC FCing, I would never press the button on the handle first since as I said, I've found numerous ones where it doesn't work or in one case, it required so much force and resulting clunky (for lack of better words), it didn't seem like an action they intended for people do to much.
When I want to stop charging I'm at the plug anyway, so pushing the button is easy to do. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. But it usually works.
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 · (Edited)
So, I'm getting unannounced free EA juice right now (Electrify America complimentary sessions (stations set...) and in the area, there are 4 CCS handles. 3 of them have broken locking tangs. This has been a recurring prob at this site + a nearby EA and EVgo sites. I wonder what's going on here. Are people dropping them? Tripping on the the cables? Or, using a huge amount of force or running into some other prob like car that won't release the plug?

I've called this into EA. I haven't checked the remaining CCS + CHAdeMO station that's on the other side of the parking lot to see if it has the same prob. It really sucks that this is a problem as it's a huge waste of $ for the charging provider to have to send someone out to fix this.
 

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Ok, when coming back from a trip to So Cal, I used a Caltrans BTC Fatboy in Delano, CA at PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You. On one of the chargers, the screen didn't work. The LCD was clearly on (had a grey screen and backlight illuminating it) but it was blank. For kicks, I plugged in and it did start charging. But, I didn't know where to press on the blank touchscreen to stop. The hardware stop button didn't work.

Here was another one where pressing even very hard on the CCS1 handle's button did NOT stop the charger at all. I couldn't even get it to the point where I could hear the microswitch in the handle clicking. It didn't seem like this was on of those two stage buttons at all. I ended up having to press stop on the infotainment system. If that failed, I'd have resorted to emergency stop.

I then switched to the other charger (same model) at the site so that I could least see the screen and its stats.
Looks like we should make a template of where the buttons are on the screen... that is assuming the touch screen is working even with the screen off.

Wonder if you could swipe your credit card to get it started like at Terribles at Jean, NV.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 · (Edited)
Looks like we should make a template of where the buttons are on the screen... that is assuming the touch screen is working even with the screen off.
Yeah, didn't seem like the touchscreen worked when it was showing nothing.

I recently used a free DC FC (Caltrans I think too) in Lodi, CA and it seemed like the hardware stop button didn't work either. I had to press on the touchscreen to stop. These were also BTC Fatboy DC FCs. The location is pretty sketchy with the homeless people around.

I dug around a bit and couldn't find a stop button my Niro EV's touchscreen UI. It's possible the stop button in Kia's app might work but I deleted my car from my Kia Connect account because from emailing and talking to their support, that's unfortunately the only way to stop location data collection. :(

I don't like that Kia is collecting and storing location info. What they expose to customer includes your start and end points, trip length and either a trip start time or end or both.

Side note: Like other BTC Fatboys, that Lodi charger is clearly amperage limited. I started out at 43 kW or lower. I think I began at like 29% SoC. At 37% SoC, I was at 43 kW. I wasn't watching the whole time but rate generally went up as my pack's voltage went up. I got as high as 47 kW at 76% SoC. At the times I looked, it was between 43 and 47 kW between 37 to 76% then at 76%, it dropped sharply to 35 kW.

In Bjorn's video at
at ~4:15 his rate sharply drops at 75% SoC.
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Since in my OP, I mentioned "stop button on the car's LCD (you may want to wake the car's or stereo's power button)", here's what I'm talking about.
Product Gadget Font Communication Device Material property
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
FWIW, now that CCS Combo 1 Adapter is officially for sale Teslas in the US (the vehicle itself must also have the proper hardware), per CCS Adapter for North America, Tesla's car-side software says:
"CCS cable button not intended to stop charging
Use touchscreen or Mobile App to disconnect"
 

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FWIW, now that CCS Combo 1 Adapter is officially for sale Teslas in the US (the vehicle itself must also have the proper hardware), per CCS Adapter for North America, Tesla's car-side software says:
"CCS cable button not intended to stop charging
Use touchscreen or Mobile App to disconnect"
That could lead to some interesting scenarios.

A few times, I have stopped a session at EA by pressing/holding the button on the handle. It apparently sends a signal to both EV and EVSE to terminate the session.

The CCS standard covers this, as I recall leaving it to either the car or EVSE to initiate termination, and sending signals to do so. It may just be the proximity pilot circuit like J1772, or it may be control pilot signaling. My guess is control pilot and Tesla didn't implement CCS fully to recognize end of session signaling in the protocol implementation, thus the warning. Tesla already follows the J1772 protocol, so proximity pilot signaling is already implemented.

Leaving it up to humans seems like a potential issue.
 

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FWIW, now that CCS Combo 1 Adapter is officially for sale Teslas in the US (the vehicle itself must also have the proper hardware), per CCS Adapter for North America, Tesla's car-side software says:
"CCS cable button not intended to stop charging
Use touchscreen or Mobile App to disconnect"
That's interesting. Does the bare Tesla supercharger connector lock into the charging port on a Tesla vehicle, and does it have an "unlock" button?
 
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