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IMO, hotels are one place that a row of ~6kW EVSEs makes sense in the short term. Ultimately you want enough, though, to support every EV driver staying at the hotel. Assume that most or all have exceeded half their range to get there. And you want to plug in and leave the car there overnight. I don't see how this scales when EVs are a significant percentage of the cars in the lot.
 

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The problem I see at airports is that once an EV is parked at a charger and the owner is gone for days, who moves the car after a full charge? A valet system would work. Or, many L2 chargers. A central source of electricity would switch charging from car A to car B to car C etc. First come first served? Or, a central L2 which would charge all in sequence. EVs are new and there is a "learning curve" on where to put chargers (and what kind of chargers). Electrify America seems to like to put their DCFC chargers near interstates---sounds logical to me. I have found DCFCs in other "remote" places--they are seldom used. I am optimistic that eventually this charger problem (where and what type) will be solved.
 

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For airports, I don't see L2 making a lot of sense. L1 actually makes more sense - simply install standard outlets that EVs can camp at for days on end. Airports should also have DCFC (>100kW) for those picking up or dropping off. If you really need L2 (e.g. gone only 12 hours), then you can use a combination of L1 and DCFC. Let the car trickle at L1 while you are gone, and grab a quick boost when you get back.

JMO
 

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I agree with most of your list, but include hotels. They need to have "good" L2 (6 KW or better) or "slow" DCFC (10 KW). I would prefer to be able to plug in at a hotel and leave my car at the charger over night. If it was 25 KW or more DCFC I would feel compelled to come down from my room and move my car after a couple hours... not something I want to do when resting on a road trip.

Keith
Hotels are definitely on the list. L2 is an excellent placement there. But I think the faster DCFC would be a valuable complement too. Think along the lines of checking in. Pull in, plug in, check in, unload the luggage. By the time you're ready to return the luggage carrier downstairs, it's already been a half hour or so and the EV has gotten a good chunk bump. Options then include moving to an L2, or heading out, or parking in a regular space.

Personally I'm not about limiting options, only adding them.

ga2500ev
 

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For airports, I don't see L2 making a lot of sense. L1 actually makes more sense - simply install standard outlets that EVs can camp at for days on end. Airports should also have DCFC (>100kW) for those picking up or dropping off. If you really need L2 (e.g. gone only 12 hours), then you can use a combination of L1 and DCFC. Let the car trickle at L1 while you are gone, and grab a quick boost when you get back.

JMO
Airports need the kitchen sink as each EV coming in has different needs. Someone coming to pick up a passenger could use medium speed DCFC. Someone on a quick in and out could use a higher powered L2 for the day. Someone on a multiday trip would be satisfied with L1.

Maybe multi-headed EVSEs are the solution. One L1/L2 with 4 or 8 plugs that serially charges 4 or 8 EVs. One company had a high powered one called the Hydra based on the concept. Instead of moving the cars, move the power.

ga2500ev
 

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At the bottom of each post there is a Reply, Quote and Like button. Is there no way to dislike a post?
 

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Airports need the kitchen sink as each EV coming in has different needs. Someone coming to pick up a passenger could use medium speed DCFC. Someone on a quick in and out could use a higher powered L2 for the day. Someone on a multiday trip would be satisfied with L1.

Maybe multi-headed EVSEs are the solution. One L1/L2 with 4 or 8 plugs that serially charges 4 or 8 EVs. One company had a high powered one called the Hydra based on the concept. Instead of moving the cars, move the power.

ga2500ev
I don't disagree that all have their place in an airport. I'm just suggesting that we start at the extremes (L1 and >100kW DC) since they will not get "the kitchen sink" all at once. I'm not suggesting we limit options either, but rather start where we get the most bang for the buck.
 

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Hotels are definitely on the list. L2 is an excellent placement there. But I think the faster DCFC would be a valuable complement too. Think along the lines of checking in. Pull in, plug in, check in, unload the luggage. By the time you're ready to return the luggage carrier downstairs, it's already been a half hour or so and the EV has gotten a good chunk bump. Options then include moving to an L2, or heading out, or parking in a regular space.

Personally I'm not about limiting options, only adding them.

ga2500ev
I have stayed at a hotel with DCFC, but the hotel didn't mention that it was EVgo and you pay for it yourself... so I ended up sitting in my car for an hour charging up to 90% for the next days driving instead of plugging into an L2 over night and not worrying about it.

Keith

PS: In my opinion if a Hotel offers L2 or DCFC as an incentive to draw customers, it should be included with the price of the room... I paid extra to stay at the nice hotel with the charger just to find out I was also paying extra for the charging. I have had this happen at hotels with slow as crap Blink L2 chargers as well. One more reason I got the TeslaTap... I will pick a Hotel with Tesla destination chargers over one with J-1772 any day of the week because I KNOW that the Tesla charger will be free of charge.
 

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Airports need the kitchen sink as each EV coming in has different needs. Someone coming to pick up a passenger could use medium speed DCFC. Someone on a quick in and out could use a higher powered L2 for the day. Someone on a multiday trip would be satisfied with L1.
Am I the only one who wonders just what the deal is with everyone wanting to charge at an airport? Isn't the typical use pattern: drive from home to airport / leave car parked at airport while away / drive back home again? Are people's homes really so far from the airport that they need an enroute charge to make the round trip? What's wrong with just parking the car and letting it sit for however long you're gone?
 

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IMO, hotels are one place that a row of ~6kW EVSEs makes sense in the short term. Ultimately you want enough, though, to support every EV driver staying at the hotel. Assume that most or all have exceeded half their range to get there. And you want to plug in and leave the car there overnight. I don't see how this scales when EVs are a significant percentage of the cars in the lot.
When people road tripping with EVs get to be a large fraction of a hotel's potential customers, hotels that don't offer reliable access to charging will find it difficult to rent rooms and will be forced to upgrade their electrical service to remain competitive. They may not all need to be 6 kW though - anyone who is staying in town for a while and not heading back out on the highway early the next morning would probably be fine with 3 kW. 3 kW could be included in the room rate and 6 or 7.2 kW could be offered as a $10/night upgrade.
 

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Discussion Starter #52
When people road tripping with EVs get to be a large fraction of a hotel's potential customers, hotels that don't offer reliable access to charging will find it difficult to rent rooms and will be forced to upgrade their electrical service to remain competitive. They may not all need to be 6 kW though - anyone who is staying in town for a while and not heading back out on the highway early the next morning would probably be fine with 3 kW. 3 kW could be included in the room rate and 6 or 7.2 kW could be offered as a $10/night upgrade.
"road tripping with EVs get to be a large fraction of a hotel's potential customers".It won't happen in my lifetime, but I'm elderly. But if that were the case, they would need many charging points to meet the demand. I don't see that happening in at least 10 years, possibly longer. I would love to see it tomorrow though. I have visited 48 states, either in my car or on a motorcycle,so I'm all for
as many chargers as they want to add ASAP.
 

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Discussion Starter #53
Am I the only one who wonders just what the deal is with everyone wanting to charge at an airport? Isn't the typical use pattern: drive from home to airport / leave car parked at airport while away / drive back home again? Are people's homes really so far from the airport that they need an enroute charge to make the round trip? What's wrong with just parking the car and letting it sit for however long you're gone?
Not everyone lives within an hour of an airport, to answer your question.
 

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"road tripping with EVs get to be a large fraction of a hotel's potential customers".It won't happen in my lifetime, but I'm elderly. But if that were the case, they would need many charging points to meet the demand. I don't see that happening in at least 10 years, possibly longer. I would love to see it tomorrow though. I have visited 48 states, either in my car or on a motorcycle,so I'm all for
as many chargers as they want to add ASAP.
I work in the hotel industry and a lot of our hotels have started putting in a few chargers. The cost involved for a few level 2 chargers isnt that much and we are always looking for a way to make the next sale.
It will be industry-wide very soon IMO, because if one chain makes it mandatory, they will all follow suit very quick. Even if only a few sales a month, we don't want that sale going to the competition.
 

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"road tripping with EVs get to be a large fraction of a hotel's potential customers".It won't happen in my lifetime, but I'm elderly.
Just as a point of comparison, most hotels in northern climes with cold weather provide AC outlets for each parking stall so that people can plug in their block heaters. They do it because their guests expect it. It's not like this sort of thing is all that terribly difficult.
 

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Discussion Starter #57
Just as a point of comparison, most hotels in northern climes with cold weather provide AC outlets for each parking stall so that people can plug in their block heaters. They do it because their guests expect it. It's not like this sort of thing is all that terribly difficult.
And in the vast majority of my country, very little of that exists. Regarding urban sprawl, yes but it has zero to do with living an hour or more from an airport and needing or not needing to charge there. What is the point you're attempting to make?
 

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And in the vast majority of my country, very little of that exists. Regarding urban sprawl, yes but it has zero to do with living an hour or more from an airport and needing or not needing to charge there. What is the point you're attempting to make?
I dunno, it just seems like a foreign experience to me to have to drive so far to the airport. I guess I'm just naive...
 

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Discussion Starter #59
I dunno, it just seems like a foreign experience to me to have to drive so far to the airport. I guess I'm just naive...
Maybe I have a little different insight having spent 32 years in the airline industry.
I no longer have free parking as an employee since I'm retired. If my trip is 5 days or longer,I use Uber or Lyft each way because its cheaper than long term parking. Many folks have a longer drive than me at 30 minutes and even those options aren't feasible due to cost.
 
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