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Well said, I don't think commenting here will get any action taken in that direction. You may be better off expressing that to the upper management of the board, but here in the basement your comments are welcomed and listened too.

Keith
I posted in two places at the same time.
 

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Easy for them to hate him when he tweets stuff just to get them riled up.... so sad that they don't see that what he is doing is intentional. It is juvenile of him to enjoy getting them spun up, but I guess everyone needs a hobby.
Are you really trying to suggest that he's constantly trying to mislead people about the COVID-19 pandemic just to goad the media? Because holding rallies and conventions in the midst of a pandemic is really, really irresponsible. And at at the same time he's goading his supporters into dangerous behaviour dressed up as political bravado.

Sure, he's a BS-er. And it certainly does get a reaction from the left. But you can't BS the virus, it will just come back to bite you. The more people who loose loved ones, the more people will turn against him - especially when they finally realize that he's BS-ed them.
 

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Discussion Starter #23
And the thousands of new cases and deaths from all the "activities" of the last month are going to materialize any minute now right? If he is holding his rally in an old folks home then yes, it is irresponsible. Otherwise get over it. If you think you are in danger, then stay home until CNN says it is safe... see you in a few years.

Keith
 

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And the thousands of new cases and deaths from all the "activities" of the last month are going to materialize any minute now right?
John Hopkins University is reporting that Alabama, Arizona, California, Florida, Nevada, North Carolina, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Carolina and Texas are seeing record high daily caseloads. 21 states in all have rising caseloads. Trump's rally and the GOP convention will be held the states that are experiencing their highest ever daily rate of cases.

Trying to argue, as Trump & Co. does, that the rising numbers are due to more testing doesn't explain why hospitalizations are rising. Texas has set new a daily high for hospitalized coronavirus patients every day for the past week. Similar news in North Carolina, Arizona, Florida, and other states.

So to answer your question: yeah, those new cases are materializing.

There certainly is some fake news being spouted, but it seems that we disagree on exactly who's Trumpeting it.

I can sympathize with a difference of opinion on how to handle the problem, as is happening in Arizona, for example. But trying to deny that there even is a problem is IMHO the height of arrogance and stupidity.
 

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And the thousands of new cases and deaths from all the "activities" of the last month are going to materialize any minute now right? If he is holding his rally in an old folks home then yes, it is irresponsible. Otherwise get over it. If you think you are in danger, then stay home until CNN says it is safe... see you in a few years.

Keith
It IS irresponsible because the young people who go to these mass gatherings might contract the virus. While they themselves are less likely to die from it, they might then pass the virus onto someone who likely will(older/obese/immune compromised). We know the transmission rates of the virus given various factors (such as how strictly a population observes social distancing) and how likely different groups are to die from contracting it. It has nothing to do with what CNN or Fox News says, this is just plain science and reality.

Now, there is a discussion around whether cost of the shutdown to save lives is worth the resulting economic pain, but I am hoping you are not denying seriousness of this communicable disease as you seem to be insinuating?
 

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Discussion Starter #26 (Edited)
Are hospitals overflowing with new Covid cases after weeks of civil unrest?

Quarantine of healthy people who are not at risk of death is insane. Quarantine of high risk group people is how you minimize death and misery. At the start when we didn't know anything about the virus (how it was spread, who was at risk, etc.) a strict advisory against large gatherings and going to crowded places was perfectly reasonable... and most people would have voluntarily complied out of their own self interest... an involuntary lock-down, and closure of all "non-essential" (weed shops and liquor stores are essential don't you know) businesses was pushing the boundaries of civil liberties to the breaking point, and panic mongering is the only reason the american public complied. With new data on how the virus spreads, and who is at grave risk all lockdowns (other than nursing homes) should have been rolled back, and social distancing / mask use should have been adopted at work places as people returned to a fairly "normal" life.

The shutdown was NEVER to prevent the spread of Covid-19, it was to SLOW the spread to keep our hospital infrastructure from being overwhelmed by floods of critical care cases when the projected death rate was 5 out of every 100 people that contracted the virus... the death of anyone is a tragic event. 5 deaths out of 100 people is terrifying, and justifies a strong response. When reality is 0.5 deaths per 100 instead of 5 deaths per 100 you need to reassess the response measures. Face it, 0.5 deaths out of 100 people is double the rate a bad flu season. Horrible to think about but true nonetheless. The death toll from flu this year could be as high as 62,000 people... around half the reported death toll from Covid... nobody knows and nobody cares because the media isn't hyping it up. The death toll from the flu EVERY year averages 56,000 people.

Make no mistake, Covid-19 is more deadly than the flu... but it is not the plague, and our current understanding of it does not justify continued draconian reactions.

Keith
 

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Quarantine of healthy people who are not at risk of death is insane.
There's a huge difference between quarantine and mass rallies. If you think quarantine is insane then the idea of holding mass rallies at a time like this is even more so, especially in states that are struggling to contain the outbreak.

Transmitting the virus is like passing around a 100-chamber revolver for Russian Roulette. Sure, you may not get the bullet, but you are complicit when that bullet finds its mark.
 

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I saw my father on a ventilator for a week an a half dying of interstitial lung disease.
Covid-19 attacks the lungs in a similar manner.
No one should go this way - it is horrible. My dad came off the ventilator for a day before passing and said his time on the vent was "a living ****". I'm going to do everything I can to keep from picking it up. Call me crazy or extreme but believe me - you do not want to be hospitalized with this thing. Even if you recover, there will likely be lasting damage. My 2 cents.
 

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Arizona, Texas, Florida again report record-high COVID-19 cases

In a Gray TV interview earlier this week, Trump said the number of cases in Oklahoma was “very minuscule,” and the virus was “dying out.”

In fact, Oklahoma has reported more than 1,100 new cases in just the past four days, with record high numbers twice in a week.
This is exactly what I mean when I say that Trump is BS-ing people. The very people who vote for him, in fact. For some reason that I'm at a loss to understand, those people think he cares about them, but I sure don't see any evidence of it.
 

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Meanwhile, here's a non-BS video.

 

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Discussion Starter #34
Her opinions no longer interest me. When someone is so delusional on reality on certain subjects it calls into question their judgment on everything.

Keith

PS: Link all of her video's you want... each one you post here will get an extra thumbs down.
 

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Just trolling. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #37
Reopening grinds to a halt as Sunbelt states witness surge in coronavirus hospitalizations

Yep, right on schedule. Clusters spawn increases in case rates which show up 2-3 weeks later. Case surges spawn hospitalizations which show up 2-3 weeks after that.

A spike in death rates follows in another 2-3 weeks. Brace yourself.
And as long as the hospitals are not overwhelmed, flattening the curve has been accomplished. A re-evaluation of the amount of reopening is in order, but a return to full shutdown is unlikely.

Keith
 

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And as long as the hospitals are not overwhelmed, flattening the curve has been accomplished. A re-evaluation of the amount of reopening is in order, but a return to full shutdown is unlikely.

Keith
Looks like Houston was at 100% ICU capacity a few days ago. Strangely, they are managing it so well and not going above and beyond 100%. ;)
 

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And as long as the hospitals are not overwhelmed, flattening the curve has been accomplished. A re-evaluation of the amount of reopening is in order, but a return to full shutdown is unlikely.
This strikes me of an all-to-common example of making an argument based on today's statistics without considering the trajectory of the disease. If hospitals are near capacity today and if the current daily number of new cases is double or more what it was two weeks ago (which is true in several states), then that argument is about to fall flat on its face.
 

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Discussion Starter #40
This strikes me of an all-to-common example of making an argument based on today's statistics without considering the trajectory of the disease. If hospitals are near capacity today and if the current daily number of new cases is double or more what it was two weeks ago (which is true in several states), then that argument is about to fall flat on its face.
That was not the message I was trying to convey. Let me rephrase to try and be more clear. The trend up and down in the curve needs continuous monitoring and adjustments to the amount of social interaction recommended and measures taken to dampen upward trends to keep us near peak health care resource utilization without going over the peak.

Say no to "everything is fine, no need for precautions!!!"

Say no to "the world is ending, never leave your home again!!!"

The problem is letting the government muck everything up. Strong recommendations for caution, social distancing, mask use etc are fine, but the way lockdown was implemented in most areas was arbitrary and actually made people complacent about their own part in protecting their own health. Also, people seeing the arbitrary nature of what was left open for business vs what was shut down leads to contempt for the authorities trying to implement the lockdown.

The net result of governmental "Covid response" was not people staying home and minimizing exposure, it was people not going to work, but still going to Walmart, Home Depot, liquor store, weed shop, etc... the whole idea of quarantining the healthy population is a fools errand. You can't quarantine people "for real" unless they have several months supply of food and other necessities in their home, and they DON'T LEAVE HOME for the duration of a quarantine. Unless you have the means and will to do this, then a half @ssed quarantine is what you get... and the result is at best a flattening of the curve if it is implemented perfectly... does anyone expect perfection from our government? The more you flatten the curve the longer the crisis lasts... we need to ride the curve at near peak hospital capacity to get this crap over with as quickly as possible with the minimum casualty rate possible. I don't think our government is capable of riding the curve, they have shown that they will clamp down too much extending the crisis, then under pressure from people sick of being at home they will open up too much too fast and risk overwhelming the hospitals... then in reaction too that they will clamp down again... and I fear that people who have been in lockdown for months will say "F it, I am not going back into total lockdown" and they will stop taking any precautions out of spite.

<sigh>

Keith
 
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