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The only flaw in your line of thinking is that under a swap with GM, you're not actually buying the new 2022 from GM, (they don't sell cars to individuals). They are simply replacing your lemon car.

The fact that GM will pay any and all government taxes and fees due on the transaction is evidence that to the extent this swap is considered a taxable sale, GM is the buyer, (who would get any tax credit available). Think in terms of anyone who leased a Bolt when tax credits were still available under the current law. The tax credit went to GM Financial, (the actual entity that "Bought" the car from the franchise dealer, and then rented it to the lessee).

IMHO, the only way to avail yourself of any new tax credit in the event such credits become law, is to go straight cash buyback, (and then buy a new 2022 from a dealer when available).
@Chris58 That's interesting and might be true. Do you have any citation or know anyone who's gone thru this (maybe tried to claim state and local credits and failed) or are you speculating?

Anyone who's successfully done a Swap, I'd love to see how the sales contract reads. I think that would tell a lot.
 

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I briefly looked at the CA Department of Consumer Affairs brochure on Lemon Law. It's not clear that the Bolt recall is covered under CA Lemon Law, but it's also not clear that GM is required to credit the consumer more than the purchase price if they replace the car with a comparable one.
My understanding of CA Lemon Law applicability is that technically, EVERY Bolt sold in CA is a lemon, (since the second recall on ~ Aug 20 no Bolt had the safety defect remedied within the required 30-day time limit). And that's in addition to the substantial impairment of use. IMO, the reason GM is doing buybacks is to avoid a flood of lawsuits they would lose. In addition, they can say they're making a goodwill gesture to keep their customers happy.

Much of the CA Lemon law is vague on a lot of things, (probably on purpose). However, the two methods, ("Replacement and Repurchase"), seem kind of clear to me.

"Repurchase" is of course the simplest option, (and it's up to the consumer to choose). The manufacturer just buys the car back for everything the consumer actually paid less usage that the owner already enjoyed. This is a strong level of relief to the buyer because cars don't depreciate linearly, (and sales taxes/registrations depreciate 100% the second the deal closes). Since the first recall on the 2017-2019MY Bolts many Bolt owners took great financial advantage of this method due to the huge delta between the price they paid originally and what you could get a 2020-2021 for this spring, (and that's even before you consider post-purchase rebates/tax credits which weren't on the original sales contract)! Although I'm new to this forum, I've no doubt that many who pulled off this play were criticized for "Getting Over" on GM.

"Replacement" is for consumers who don't want to buy a new car like you and I. We just want our cars replaced. This is complicated by the simple fact that GM has no "Comparable" cars to offer us. This is not a unique situation because auto manufacturers routinely discontinue production of specific models. What then for the consumer? What does "Substantially Identical" mean? In the absence of an identical car, it can ONLY mean price. If price has to be used as the metric, it must be a number that is in some way transferable between completely different cars. I believe the number GM uses is an internal number that is most likely the "Book" price that GM sells the car to the dealer for. I don't think incentives available at the time or how good a negotiator the buyer was have any relevance to this consumer remedy, (unlike the above remedy).



@Chris58 That's interesting and might be true. Do you have any citation or know anyone who's gone thru this (maybe tried to claim state and local credits and failed) or are you speculating?

Anyone who's successfully done a Swap, I'd love to see how the sales contract reads. I think that would tell a lot.
Just my opinion Eric.

You're correct it would be interesting to see how the paperwork reads for a finished swap. Perhaps it's a sales contract, or maybe it's not the same sort of agreement?

You might look up the member here who completed a swap for a Blazer he immediately flipped. I believe his user name is something like cbro999.

I seem to recall he's in MD, so contracts in that state would of course be different than CA.
 

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@Chris58 That's interesting and might be true. Do you have any citation or know anyone who's gone thru this (maybe tried to claim state and local credits and failed) or are you speculating?

Anyone who's successfully done a Swap, I'd love to see how the sales contract reads. I think that would tell a lot.
One fellow from Texas had 10k or more deducted of his loan doing a swap with new MSRP being less. If you don’t have a loan it becomes less clear what happens. Another fellow claimed over 18 to20+ k$. Highest number I have seen.
There was a few others but not a lot reported on the GM write ups
 

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@bro1999 What state are you in? I'm in CA. I received a $6,500 GM credit when I bought my 2019 Bolt. Both my EV concierge and the letter I received from GM explicitly stated that the $6,500 would be deducted from the swap credit calculation. Also my EV concierge started with the ~$34,000 dealer price (i.e., before the $6,500 GM credit) not the $38,000 MSRP. I paid $29,735 otd including taxes and DMV fees. That's the price (less mileage deduction) my concierge claims will be my credit.

Maybe it's different in CA or maybe my EV concierge got it wrong.
I'm in MD. If the person telling you they are 100% sure the $6,500 GM factory incentive you received at time of purchase will be deducted from your swap credit, I would 100% not believe them. They do not handle those calculations...that is all done by GM's repurchase department. Almost certain they are confusing the repurchase math with the trade replacement/swap math. Unless the repurchase department rep you are assigned tells you the exact same thing, I would take anything the (what sounds like 2nd level EV concierge at best who is completely detached from the repurchase department) with a boulder of salt. The EV concierge I dealt with gave me all kinds of inaccurate info.

I received an $8k GM factory incentive for my '19 Bolt, and the "base price of vehicle" for a MSRP $43,905 Bolt Premier on my buyer's order before TTL was $30,270, or $13.6k off MSRP.

Here's the part of my official offer letter reflecting the $10,100 downgrade "credit":
Font Screenshot Number Document Parallel


And here's the text of an email my repurchase coordinator (not 2nd level EV concierge) told me about the downgrade credit and how it's applied:
Font Screenshot Number Parallel Document


Part 3 is specific to my case and Maryland...I owed just shy of $30k on my Bolt at the time my offer letter was prepared. If I owed nothing on my Bolt, I believe I would have simply forfeited any swap credit I did not use (in my case, $10.1k). I believe my downgrade credit was limited to whatever I owed on my Bolt. Since I owed more than the downgrade, I received the full amount as a credit towards the replacement vehicle.

But I can say as a MD resident, I received my Bolt's full MSRP as swap credit despite receiving nearly $14k in dealer/factory discounts/incentives.
 

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I'm in MD. If the person telling you they are 100% sure the $6,500 GM factory incentive you received at time of purchase will be deducted from your swap credit, I would 100% not believe them. They do not handle those calculations...that is all done by GM's repurchase department. Almost certain they are confusing the repurchase math with the trade replacement/swap math. Unless the repurchase department rep you are assigned tells you the exact same thing, I would take anything the (what sounds like 2nd level EV concierge at best who is completely detached from the repurchase department) with a boulder of salt. The EV concierge I dealt with gave me all kinds of inaccurate info.

I received an $8k GM factory incentive for my '19 Bolt, and the "base price of vehicle" for a MSRP $43,905 Bolt Premier on my buyer's order before TTL was $30,270, or $13.6k off MSRP.

Here's the part of my official offer letter reflecting the $10,100 downgrade "credit":
View attachment 38923

And here's the text of an email my repurchase coordinator (not 2nd level EV concierge) told me about the downgrade credit and how it's applied:
View attachment 38922

Part 3 is specific to my case and Maryland...I owed just shy of $30k on my Bolt at the time my offer letter was prepared. If I owed nothing on my Bolt, I believe I would have simply forfeited any swap credit I did not use (in my case, $10.1k). I believe my downgrade credit was limited to whatever I owed on my Bolt. Since I owed more than the downgrade, I received the full amount as a credit towards the replacement vehicle.

But I can say as a MD resident, I received my Bolt's full MSRP as swap credit despite receiving nearly $14k in dealer/factory discounts/incentives.
Thanks @bro1999 . That's very helpful.

Yes, I'm aware that my EV Concierge may be wrong (which is why I'm asking here.) I do not have a loan on my Bolt, so if it works the same in CA as in MD, I would lose about $6,500 in credit since I tried to match my replacement vehicle price close to my trade credit. If that's true, I hope the Repurchase agent lets me select a new vehicle.

In my case, since I want to get a new Bolt, it's more complicated. Because of the Stop Sale, it only gets to the Repurchase team if you order one, as opposed to getting an already built one sitting on the Dealer's lot.

It would be great if someone in CA who's completed a Swap could chime in. I've read some posts stating that in CA GM does figure the Swap credit the way my EV Concierge explained, but I haven't seen anything definitive.
 

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Thanks @bro1999 . That's very helpful.

Yes, I'm aware that my EV Concierge may be wrong (which is why I'm asking here.) I do not have a loan on my Bolt, so if it works the same in CA as in MD, I would lose about $6,500 in credit since I tried to match my replacement vehicle price close to my trade credit. If that's true, I hope the Repurchase agent lets me select a new vehicle.

In my case, since I want to get a new Bolt, it's more complicated. Because of the Stop Sale, it only gets to the Repurchase team if you order one, as opposed to getting an already built one sitting on the Dealer's lot.

It would be great if someone in CA who's completed a Swap could chime in. I've read some posts stating that in CA GM does figure the Swap credit the way my EV Concierge explained, but I haven't seen anything definitive.
If you have to go more expensive do what I am, order a truck or something else that holds value and then trade that in for a Bolt when ready, when they are available, tax credit dust has settled
 

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I've read some posts stating that in CA GM does figure the Swap credit the way my EV Concierge explained, but I haven't seen anything definitive.
That is what my RC said to me, that in CA, downgrade credit doesn't apply. He even told me that my best option is to take the straight buyback route and buy the car (Trailblazer) on a separate deal with the dealer.
 

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That is what my RC said to me, that in CA, downgrade credit doesn't apply. He even told me that my best option is to take the straight buyback route and buy the car (Trailblazer) on a separate deal with the dealer.
By downgrade credit, you mean if the replacement car's price is less than the replacement credit that GM allows for your Bolt? My question is whether in CA GM counts whatever GM incentive it gave the customer when he purchased the vehicle. Additionally, whether GM will do that when the customer owns the car outright with no loan.

@bro1999's case differs in 2 respects: 1) He's in MD; 2) He had a loan on his car.

Also, why would you be better off with a straight repurchase? GM wouldn't pay the the sales tax on the new Blazer if you did that. Did you get a big GM credit when you bought your Bolt? Does your RC claim that GM will give you that GM credit (that you already got when you bought your Bolt) as part of a straight repurchase?
 

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By downgrade credit, you mean if the replacement car's price is less than the replacement credit that GM allows for your Bolt? My question is whether in CA GM counts whatever GM incentive it gave the customer when he purchased the vehicle. Additionally, whether GM will do that when the customer owns the car outright with no loan.


Also, why would you be better off with a straight repurchase? GM wouldn't pay the the sales tax on the new Blazer if you did that. Did you get a big GM credit when you bought your Bolt? Does your RC claim that GM will give you that GM credit (that you already got when you bought your Bolt) as part of a straight repurchase?
I did get $8,500 GM rebate when I bought my 2020 Bolt LT. For straight repurchase, that $8500 credit will not be part of the calculation. You won't get that back.

Here is what I posted regarding price breakdown of my buyback offer from GM.
 

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Thanks @bro1999 . That's very helpful.

Yes, I'm aware that my EV Concierge may be wrong (which is why I'm asking here.) I do not have a loan on my Bolt, so if it works the same in CA as in MD, I would lose about $6,500 in credit since I tried to match my replacement vehicle price close to my trade credit. If that's true, I hope the Repurchase agent lets me select a new vehicle.

In my case, since I want to get a new Bolt, it's more complicated. Because of the Stop Sale, it only gets to the Repurchase team if you order one, as opposed to getting an already built one sitting on the Dealer's lot.

It would be great if someone in CA who's completed a Swap could chime in. I've read some posts stating that in CA GM does figure the Swap credit the way my EV Concierge explained, but I haven't seen anything definitive.
So here's the actual text of CA's Lemon Law relevant to buyback/replacement calculations:

California Civil Code 1793.2 said:
(d) (1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), if the manufacturer or its representative in this state does not service or repair the goods to conform to the applicable express warranties after a reasonable number of attempts, the manufacturer shall either replace the goods or reimburse the buyer in an amount equal to the purchase price paid by the buyer, less that amount directly attributable to use by the buyer prior to the discovery of the nonconformity.
(2) If the manufacturer or its representative in this state is unable to service or repair a new motor vehicle, as that term is defined in paragraph (2) of subdivision (e) of Section 1793.22, to conform to the applicable express warranties after a reasonable number of attempts, the manufacturer shall either promptly replace the new motor vehicle in accordance with subparagraph (A) or promptly make restitution to the buyer in accordance with subparagraph (B). However, the buyer shall be free to elect restitution in lieu of replacement, and in no event shall the buyer be required by the manufacturer to accept a replacement vehicle.
(A) In the case of replacement, the manufacturer shall replace the buyer’s vehicle with a new motor vehicle substantially identical to the vehicle replaced. The replacement vehicle shall be accompanied by all express and implied warranties that normally accompany new motor vehicles of that specific kind. The manufacturer also shall pay for, or to, the buyer the amount of any sales or use tax, license fees, registration fees, and other official fees which the buyer is obligated to pay in connection with the replacement, plus any incidental damages to which the buyer is entitled under Section 1794, including, but not limited to, reasonable repair, towing, and rental car costs actually incurred by the buyer.
(B) In the case of restitution, the manufacturer shall make restitution in an amount equal to the actual price paid or payable by the buyer, including any charges for transportation and manufacturer-installed options, but excluding nonmanufacturer items installed by a dealer or the buyer, and including any collateral charges such as sales or use tax, license fees, registration fees, and other official fees, plus any incidental damages to which the buyer is entitled under Section 1794, including, but not limited to, reasonable repair, towing, and rental car costs actually incurred by the buyer.
(C) When the manufacturer replaces the new motor vehicle pursuant to subparagraph (A), the buyer shall only be liable to pay the manufacturer an amount directly attributable to use by the buyer of the replaced vehicle prior to the time the buyer first delivered the vehicle to the manufacturer or distributor, or its authorized service and repair facility for correction of the problem that gave rise to the nonconformity. When restitution is made pursuant to subparagraph (B), the amount to be paid by the manufacturer to the buyer may be reduced by the manufacturer by that amount directly attributable to use by the buyer prior to the time the buyer first delivered the vehicle to the manufacturer or distributor, or its authorized service and repair facility for correction of the problem that gave rise to the nonconformity. The amount directly attributable to use by the buyer shall be determined by multiplying the actual price of the new motor vehicle paid or payable by the buyer, including any charges for transportation and manufacturer-installed options, by a fraction having as its denominator 120,000 and having as its numerator the number of miles traveled by the new motor vehicle prior to the time the buyer first delivered the vehicle to the manufacturer or distributor, or its authorized service and repair facility for correction of the problem that gave rise to the nonconformity. Nothing in this paragraph shall in any way limit the rights or remedies available to the buyer under any other law.
(D) Pursuant to Section 1795.4, a buyer of a new motor vehicle shall also include a lessee of a new motor vehicle.


Section C covers replacements, but I can only find text specifically describing how they calculate the usage fee (which is based off the actual price paid for the vehicle multiplied by mileage/120,000). However, I don't see any verbage that specifically states what the starting value is for the MSRP credit before usage fee is deducted.
 

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I did get $8,500 GM rebate when I bought my 2020 Bolt LT. For straight repurchase, that $8500 credit will not be part of the calculation. You won't get that back.

Here is what I posted regarding price breakdown of my buyback offer from GM.
Thanks @utsug . If I read your post correctly, your OTD price was $30,000 + $3,700 -> $33,700? And GM credited you $29,000? (GM doesn't care about CVRP or any state or local credit)
 

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Thanks @bro1999. I think the key is

(A) In the case of replacement, the manufacturer shall replace the buyer’s vehicle with a new motor vehicle substantially identical to the vehicle replaced.
If (as in my case) I'm getting another Bolt, it's pretty clear that a 2022 Bolt EV LT1 (stripped) is substantially similar to a 2019 Bolt EV LT (stripped), so I don't see any reason GM would have to give me trade credit for more than the dealer price of 2022 Bolt EV LT1 - $31,995. That's less than both my 2019's MSRP (~$38,000) and dealer price before the $6,500 GM credit (~$34,500), but more than my 2019 OTD price $29,735 (including taxes). If that's how it's done, GM should just give me the 2022 (since it's substantially similar) without any calculations other than a usage deduction. That's pretty close to what my EV concierge figured (though she got there a different way.)

It's obviously not clear at all from the CA statute, how it should be calculated if you get a completely different car, like a Blazer.

A couple other factors 1) I don't have a loan; 2) the dealer price is usually lower than the MSRP and it differs from dealer to dealer.

I've asked my EV Concierge numerous times what "substantially similar" means and never got an answer other than, "You'll have to pay for any upgrades." The "substantially similar" language is in my initial repurchase approval letter
 

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Thanks @bro1999. I think the key is



If (as in my case) I'm getting another Bolt, it's pretty clear that a 2022 Bolt EV LT1 (stripped) is substantially similar to a 2019 Bolt EV LT (stripped), so I don't see any reason GM would have to give me trade credit for more than the dealer price of 2022 Bolt EV LT1 - $31,995. That's less than both my 2019's MSRP (~$38,000) and dealer price before the $6,500 GM credit (~$34,500), but more than my 2019 OTD price $29,735 (including taxes). If that's how it's done, GM should just give me the 2022 (since it's substantially similar) without any calculations other than a usage deduction. That's pretty close to what my EV concierge figured (though she got there a different way.)

It's obviously not clear at all from the CA statute, how it should be calculated if you get a completely different car, like a Blazer.

A couple other factors 1) I don't have a loan; 2) the dealer price is usually lower than the MSRP and it differs from dealer to dealer.
I think all "substantially similar" really means is a vehicle with similar sticker price. So if you wanted to swap into a similarly priced Silverado, it would still fit under the "substantially similar" clause.
 

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Thanks @utsug . If I read your post correctly, your OTD price was $30,000 + $3,700 -> $33,700? And GM credited you $29,000? (GM doesn't care about CVRP or any state or local credit)
Yes $33,700 (OTD and tax). GM doesn't care about the CVRP or other rebates you get from state of federal.
Actually my post was wrong. The $5k down payment was from CVAP and not CVRP.
CVRP rebate you get after purchasing the vehicle. But CVAP is like a voucher that you bring to the dealership and use it as a down payment. Looks like I could have gotten that $6k down payment ($5k from CVAP and $1k out of pocket) I made but due to my usage of $6250, I only got about $5800 back.
Dont forget that CVRP rebate has rules that you need to own the car for 30 months or 36 months otherwise you need to return part of the rebate back.
 

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I think all "substantially similar" really means is a vehicle with similar sticker price. So if you wanted to swap into a similarly priced Silverado, it would still fit under the "substantially similar" clause.
If you interpret it that way, reading the statute you cited still seems to allow GM to use the actual price the customer paid as the basis for the trade credit rather than the sticker price. That is, I don't see where it would require GM to add in the original GM credit as part of the customer's trade in credit (i.e., I lose the $6,500 MFG credit)
 

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If you interpret it that way, reading the statute you cited still seems to allow GM to use the actual price the customer paid as the basis for the trade credit rather than the sticker price. That is, I don't where it would require GM to add in the original GM credit as part of the customers trade in credit (i.e., I lose the $6,500 MFG credit)
That could be why there are no confirmed MSRP swap stories from CA'ers...
 

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If the new tax credit goes thru the Senate. And a “ trade repurchase” done in 22 is considered a buy in 22. Then it could be applied to the swap. That would be nice, but no one can answer that till the bill gets out of the senate.

Next question would be if it can apply to a buyback and not a swap then a buyback should be the better deal. Not a swap. But no one knows yet
 

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If the new tax credit goes thru the Senate. And a “ trade repurchase” done in 22 is considered a buy in 22. Then it could be applied to the swap. That would be nice, but no one can answer that till the bill gets out of the senate.

Next question would be if it can apply to a buyback and not a swap then a buyback should be the better deal. Not a swap. But no one knows yet
No. If you do a straight repurchase, as opposed to a trade repurchase, that means GM just cuts you a check. You won't be eligible for any EV credit unless you buy another EV. We don't need to know what comes out of the Senate to know that.
 

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No. If you do a straight repurchase, as opposed to a trade repurchase, that means GM just cuts you a check. You won't be eligible for any EV credit unless you buy another EV. We don't need to know what comes out of the Senate to know that.
Hello

Of course, you have to buy another EV to get the tax credit on a buyback. I assume buyback=straight repurchase, with GM doing the purchasing.

On a trade repurchase (=Swap) it's not so clear. As the other thread on this topic (I just saw) shows that many are not sure.
 

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Hello

Of course, you have to buy another EV to get the tax credit on a buyback. I assume buyback=straight repurchase, with GM doing the purchasing.

On a trade repurchase (=Swap) it's not so clear. As the other thread on this topic (I just saw) shows that many are not sure.
A trade replacement/swap deal is considered a sale just as if you purchased the vehicle regularly. I even received 20,000 Chevy rewards points for my swap (how many points you get for purchasing a new vehicle) even though I didn't pay a single penny out of pocket. If anyone swaps for a new Bolt EV, they will be eligible for any tax credit that is available at the time of purchase.
 
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