[Chevy Bolt News]

America’s president-elect wants to reduce federal spending and it could put electric vehicle incentives in jeopardy. That means, no more Chevy Bolts for under $30k.

Reduced or outright loosing the federal incentive could drive up the Bolt’s MSRP and negatively affect Bolt sales. The success of the first generation of affordable long range electric vehicles including the Tesla Model 3 is largely based on the U.S. tax credit which can go up to $7,500. Without it, both Chevy and Tesla may not sell as many units as originally predicted.

That in turn may affect the manufacturing plant in Orion, Michigan, as that is where the Chevy Bolt is being produced. Counterproductive if you take into account Trump’s plans to increase manufacturing jobs in the automotive industry.

According to Autoweek, short term product development plans shouldn’t be affected as models that are set to be launched between now and 2018 are already paid for. Maybe this would motivate LG to come out with even cheaper lithium ion batteries in order to give manufacturers a little more breathing room. Back in 2011, battery costs were around $300 per kilowatt-hour and now it’s around $145. Maybe we’ll see prices drop to around $100 per kilowatt-hour in another 6 years.

This is all speculation for now. An incentive cut may not come to pass and the Bolt should be hitting dealerships nationwide before any tax credit changes are made.

 

[devbolt]

It will take an act of Congress to reduce the federal tax credit for EVs. It's not up to Trump, other than to decide whether to sign whatever law Congress passes regarding the incentive.

 

[DucRider]

Everything that Obama did by executive order can be undone by a Trump executive order. That includes the administrative expansion (Congress wouldn't play ball) of the Clean Air Act.
The tax credit will likely remain, but many of the other policies like fleet fuel efficiency, etc are likely off the table.

Using executive orders to sidestep Congress results in what should be long term policies that are easily undone by later Presidents.

 

[Bazinga]

Well he's definitely not going to go out of his way to help the EV industry advance. Maybe news sources are biased, but nothing good is coming out of Trump's mouth these days...

 

[DrZip]

Yes, Chevy Bolt News, concerning battery prices dropping, the Bolt battery pack is based on the Lithium 18650 technology, (once the standard in laptop computers) which was predicted to continue to fall in prices.
Interesting the new Tesla 3 in addition to making their own battery, skewing from the standard with a slightly larger and more efficient battery, possibly creating a whole new category of batteries for the 2020 decade of cars, and being a non-propitiatory technology, could lower battery cost even more, with a battery technology truly designed for the transportation industry.

 

[DucRider]

Yes, Chevy Bolt News, concerning battery prices dropping, the Bolt battery pack is based on the Lithium 18650 technology, (once the standard in laptop computers) which was predicted to continue to fall in prices.
Interesting the new Tesla 3 in addition to making their own battery, skewing from the standard with a slightly larger and more efficient battery, possibly creating a whole new category of batteries for the 2020 decade of cars, and being a non-propitiatory technology, could lower battery cost even more, with a battery technology truly designed for the transportation industry.

18650 is not a "technology" it refers to the shape and size of the cell (in this case an 18 mm x 65 mm cylinder). The Panasonic 18650 produced for Tesla use a "custom" chemistry. The Gigafactory will be producing a different cylindrical cell size (2170 or 21 mm x 70 mm) for the Model 3 and Powerwalls - and is also reported to have a new chemistry. Musk says the new size and chemistry make it "the best cell in the world that is also the cheapest cell." But no details have been released.

The Bolt uses LiPo or Lithium Ion Polymer cells which are a completely different form factor. LiPo cells are "pouch" style and as such are soft sided. (Note Lithium Polymer was at one time used to describe a battery chemistry with polymer used as the electrolyte - but never left the lab and entered production). They can be manufactured in many different shapes and are more flexible when designing batteries (batteries are made up of groups of cells).

The same battery chemistry could be used in either an 18650 or LiPo cell.

LiPo pouches are lighter and have higher capacity (the Bolt cell is likely 65 Ah and the "new" Tesla 2170 is 5.75 Ah). They can be manufactured in many shapes and thus the modules and packs are easier to configure in an EV battery pack. However, when designing an EV battery with LiPo cells, you need to use a "case" for them. much of the lighter weight is due to the lack of structural integrity. If not contained in a rigid enclosure (the 18650 and other cylindrical cells have hard cases), pouch batteries will deform and inflate as SOC increases. The Bolt uses 96 modules in series, each module contains 3 "pouches" in a hard case.

Tesla's 60 kWh battery has ~5,300 cells. The Bolt has 288. There advantages and disadvantages to both approaches.

The LG cells in the Bolt contain a new "nickel rich" chemistry developed specifically for EV's by GM/LG.

 

[DrZip]

Chevy Bolt Lithium Battery

I agree with most of what you said DucRider, the point being that lithium ion battery technology, with it's various chemical variations (including nickel-rich lithium-ion), and it's physical vessel housings (18560, pouch, etc.), is improving, decreasing in price, and developing for specialized industries including the transportation industry.

The 2017 Chevy Bolt lithium battery includes 3 pouches of 96 modules in series = 288 cells, in the battery world called a 96s3p (96 series 3 parallel) configuration.

 

[fargoneandout]

Trump has made many statements which later proved to be, how shall we say, less than forthcoming. He seems prone to making grandiose proclamations and letting others fill in the blanks. Who he names as his Secretary of Energy will likely have far more impact on his policy than statements he has made heretofore. All the same he isn't likely to suddenly morph into Tanya Treehugger. And I doubt very much whether EV's will be as high on his first 100 day radar as other, far more pressing issues such as deportations, abortion, gay marriage, financial industry de-regulation, and so on.

 

[LeftieBiker]

It will take an act of Congress to reduce the federal tax credit for EVs

Even if that is the case, it will be a Republican Congress, ready to make it happen. I suggest that people who want to avoid this start working to convince Trump that what's needed instead is a less elitist version of the tax credit. It could be a point of sale rebate, to allow retired people like me, with adequate incomes but not a lot of taxable income, to buy an EV. It could also be limited to or weighted for vehicles produced in the US, to promote American jobs, and it could have an income limit. People who buy a Tesla rarely need the $7500 incentive, while those buying a Leaf or Volt or Bolt usually do. This could also possibly be promoted (although I'd be unwilling to do it) as a way to avoid shutting down newer coal power plants, by reducing urban and suburban vehicle emissions instead. In any case the EV tax credit is in serious, immediate danger.

 

[Raymondjram]

2017 Chevy Bolt EV wins Motor Trend "Car of the Year" award

Has anyone noticed that the 2017 Chevy Bolt has won the Motor Trend "Car of the Year" award? Here is the direct link to the Motor Trend page and announcement:
http://www.motortrend.com/news/chevrolet-bolt-ev-2017-car-of-the-year/

Now I want to see many smiling faces!

BTW, Toyota presented two Prius models. The Prius Prime was a "no show" (it never arrived), and the othe Prius was so boring to drive that is wasn't even a finalist!

 

[LightningBolt]

It could go either way at this point, Trump is more interested in deregulating certain energy production sectors but he's probably going to appoint a republican as teh Secretary of Energy and they'll be looking into what they can cut away.

 

[Roth33d]

Has anyone noticed that the 2017 Chevy Bolt has won the Motor Trend "Car of the Year" award? Here is the direct link to the Motor Trend page and announcement:
http://www.motortrend.com/news/chevrolet-bolt-ev-2017-car-of-the-year/

Now I want to see many smiling faces!

BTW, Toyota presented two Prius models. The Prius Prime was a "no show" (it never arrived), and the othe Prius was so boring to drive that is wasn't even a finalist!

Just goes to show even when one car maker has a lot of skin in this game they can still be over taken to some extent, impressive outcome on GM's end here.

But Toyota said they will be ramping up efforts on the green car end, that will be interesting to see.

 

[Bazinga]

There's a few great contenders on the finalists list, surprised the Bolt won over the Pacifica or a nice Porsche 911.

 

[DrZip]

Volkswagen cuts 30,000 jobs

Any one notice that Volkswagen announced today that they would cut 30,000 jobs to focus on electric vehicles, I am sure they are watching Bolt news with it's backlog of orders and American (Detroit) jobs!

 

[PeterT]

Maybe its a good time to buy Volkswagen stock with that good news.

 

[DrZip]

LOL: So they can cheat and lie about their electrical performance too.

Maybe its a good time to buy Volkswagen stock with that good news.

 

[fargoneandout]

Car companies are not stupid. They are in business to make money and, unlike the head-in-the-sand crowd, began to rationally assess the impact global warming and increasing CO(2) are having and taking measures to mitigate their risks. Even if Trump does away with the credit, which would indeed suck, EV's are here to stay. Their strategic planning time horizon is longer than a presidential term and their planners must contend with the possibility that the next POTUS and Congress have very different views than Trump and his key opinion leaders.

He might do away with the credit, but what does it gain him or his administration? Votes? I think his attention will be drawn to elements of his platform most likely to resonate with his constituents, chiefly abortion, immigration, trade, and political vendettas against his many opponents.

 

[LeftieBiker]

Car companies are not stupid. They are in business to make money and, unlike the head-in-the-sand crowd, began to rationally assess the impact global warming and increasing CO(2) are having and taking measures to mitigate their risks.

The manufacture of EVs by car companies not dedicated to building only EVs is in response to zero emissions rules that require that they do so in order to continue to make profitable larger cars and trucks. GM is one of the companies to just this week request a rollback of emissions standards by Trump next year. (Toyota was another, but Nissan, who sells ZEV credits from leaf sales, wasn't.) If Trump eliminates ZEV mandates, then watch the non-American companies fall back to Europe and Asiato sell EVs, and GM to follow them , by focusing on sales of the Opal Ampera-E rather than the Bolt.

 

[DucRider]

The manufacture of EVs by car companies not dedicated to building only EVs is in response to zero emissions rules that require that they do so in order to continue to make profitable larger cars and trucks. GM is one of the companies to just this week request a rollback of emissions standards by Trump next year. (Toyota was another, but Nissan, who sells ZEV credits from leaf sales, wasn't.) If Trump eliminates ZEV mandates, then watch the non-American companies fall back to Europe and Asiato sell EVs, and GM to follow them , by focusing on sales of the Opal Ampera-E rather than the Bolt.

Trump has no control or say so over ZEV credits. CARB administers the program and car manufacturers must earn or buy credits to continue to sell in CA (this is a very simple explanation of a very complex set of rules). There are 9 "ZEV" States that have signed on to follow the CARB rules.
The Federal Tax Credit also cannot be eliminated by Trump. The Internal Revenue Code is written and administered by Congress, and any change would be thru them. Possible to push for it, but not as easy as issuing an Executive Order.
CAFE standards are more easily influenced or changed by the President. Under the Obama administration, the 2011 Model year standard was set 1 MPG lower (27.3) than originally recommended in the Energy Independence and Security Act (35 MPG by 2020) signed by Bush in 2007.
Trump will certainly value energy independence, but is much more likely to look to increasing US (North American) production of fossil fuels than continuing to "force" fuel economy increases or renewable energy. These policy shifts will take time, but reducing fuel economy standards is low hanging fruit (more fine are collected for not meeting standards from foreign companies than the big three, but that's likely to be ignored).
Interesting times to say the least.

 

[bro1999]

CA ZEV mandates are set in stone through 2025. After that, no orange dude will be in the White House. So it's gonna be OK. Assuming the Orange one doesn't flush our country down the toilet the next 4 years.